Dr. Brown will share some highlights from the day’s tour, take your questions and questions from the tour group, and explain why a Christian version of Al-Qaeda doesn’t exist. Listen live here 2-4 pm EST, and call into the show at (866) 348 7884 with your questions and comments.
Dr. Brown’s Bottom Line: God is doing amazing things in the Middle East, especially among the Muslim people. Pray for laborers for the harvest!
Dr. Brown’s Bottom Line: There is one true God and one true God alone. He has made Himself known to us through His son, Jesus the Messiah!
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This week, we’re offering two important resources from Dr. Brown, his brand new book, Can You Be Gay and Christian?, and his DVD debate with gay activist (and professing born-again Christian) Harry Knox. You can get both of these key resources for the super low price of just $25! Postage Paid! That’s a $15 savings!
The revelation in the Koran is false. I believe that it comes from the Devil. However, Muslims do not necessarily worship a false god, if they profess to worship the God of Abraham. Because the God of Abraham is the only God, those who invoke Him, or try to invoke Him, in earnest and devoutly, even if in ignorance and without supernatural faith, they are not idolaters. The Koran tells lies about the true God, and, frankly, so does the Talmud, but there is some recognition of God’s identity in these texts.
Visiting Israel over the radio is a termendous blessing for all your listener’s. Your having a blessed time and we are too! This is one of the highlights of your career listening to you last night talking in with other Jewish beliver’s and fellow radio guys. I missed a trip of a lifetime, but I am loving these ten days of being a listener and hearing how richly God revelation is to you personally and the people on this trip with you.
A question from today’s show:
Has Dr. Brown explained where he got his “10 to 15% of Muslims are radicals” claim?
That number seems WAY too high.
I lived in Muslim countries for many years and I’d estimate the percentage of militants/radicals at around around 0.1%.
And I lived in a hotbed of radicalism! In America the number would be much, much lower.
But, of course, it depends on how one defines “radical.”
For example, is the NRA a “radical group” because it advocates the rights of anti-government groups to stockpile weapons? Or are the Southern Baptists a “militant group” because they endorsed an unprovoked military attack against Iraq?
Any idea where Dr. Brown gets his “10 to 15%” number? He’s used the number before. Is it just made up? Is he repeating something he heard on right wing talk radio? Dr. Brown is horrible at vetting his sources.
A comment from todays show:
Dr. Brown asked the Muslim caller if he was devout and then said that, in his experience, Muslims who pray five times a day, fast on Ramadan, do Haj, etc. are more likely to be radical.
That isn’t my personal experience at all.
As an Evangelical Christian, I have had a much more positive experience with observant Muslims than nominal ones. And the few Taliban I knew seemed like religious frauds, to me.
I have shared living situations with devout Muslims — both Shiite and Sunni — and found them friendly and helpful. The last place I lived, I shared a “duplex” with a devout Shiite family — they did the whole Muslim thing — prayed, fasted, Haj, ate halal, purda, etc.
I didn’t hesitate to let my young daughter hang out in their home. And we had no_problems. I wish she had spent more time there — maybe her Farsi would be better. There are plenty of nominal Muslims I would not have done that with.
>>The Koran tells lies about the true God, and, frankly, so does the Talmud, but there is some recognition of God’s identity in these texts.
I’m curious… what lies do you think the Talmud tells about God?
I know almost nothing about the Talmud.
>>Muslims do not necessarily worship a false god,
It is easy to know the Muslim view of God because of their “99 names” for him, which is basically an attribute list.
While I like some of the names better than others, they all seem pretty biblical. (I can’t say I’ve scrutinized every one.)
Here is the list:
I’d like to know how closely this Muslim understanding of God is to your own, Christian understanding of Him.
Greg when are you going to answer one question for me?
Question. Are you interested in attending a program with M. Brown?
There is a program June 21 2014.
One major difference between Yaweh and Allah is this:
In the Qur’an, s.3:54, Allah is called the greatest deceiver/cheater.
Wamakaroo wamakara Allahu waAllahu khayru almakireena
And they cheated/deceived and God cheated/deceived, and God (is) the best (of) the cheaters/deceivers.
The Pickthal version translates it as such:
And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers.
This particular Surah in context is denying that Jesus was crucified as claimed in the Bible.
On the other hand we read in the Bible that Yaweh does not lie, nor deceive:
19 God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?
18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
I point this out just to highlight differences between Allah and Yaweh.
I had to Google it — some Muslims say that the verse should be translated “planner” not “deceiver. ”
My translation (Penquin) says “plotter” — which seems like a nice split the difference Plotter can go either way.
Did you look at the 99 names of God? From my real-world experience with Muslims, this list is a very fundamental way they understand God.
I was hoping Nicholas would answer me. If Satan wrote the Quran, it seems like he has a fairly Christian understanding of God.
By the way — while I feel it is my duty to defend Muslims against false-witness, I am not a defender of the Quran or Islam.
I do know that you can’t fully understand Muslims by searching for negative verses in the Quran any more than fully understand Christians by searching for negative verses in the Bible.
I do remember you asking me to attend a Dr. Brown meeting. I might go to one if he came here to Oregon.
I’m not sure how seeing him in person would change my mind about the few things we differ on and the many things we agree on.
So, nobody knows where Dr. Browns 10 to 15% statistic comes from?
Does that number even pass the sniff test?
There about approximately 2.5 million Muslims in America.
That would be 250,000 to 375,000 radicals inside the United States! What aren’t we getting hit by terrorist attacks every week?
I would guess that the real number of radicals is in the hundreds or very low thousands.
Didn’t Mohammed get his first commandments and revelations from an angel? Supposedly Gabriel?
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Even though the religion of Islam does not allow a person to worship in a way that is informed or correct, an individual Muslim who is sincere and seeks to please the God of Abraham, even if his understanding of God is deficient, even if his religion is false, worships the true God. There is only one God, and Muslims do strive to worship Him. It’s not like Muslims worship Zeus and have no concept whatsoever of the revelation of the Biblical God. Islam rejects that Christ is the Son of God. Islam denies the Trinity. The Koran makes it clear that God is not a Father. These are all falsehoods, so we must be clear that Islam does not teach the truth about God, even if it acknowledges Him on some level. Regarding the Talmud, for one thing, it calumniates Christ.
“I had to Google it — some Muslims say that the verse should be translated “planner” not “deceiver.”
My translation (Penquin) says “plotter” — which seems like a nice split the difference Plotter can go either way.”
Yes true, ‘planner’ is the most common way it is rendered in English Qur’ans. But the Arabic does not reflect such. To help determine which is more accurate, planner or deceiver, we need to look at what the Qur’an says about the cross of Messiah.
“And that is what the Qur’an claims happened in regard to the crucifixion of Jesus. Whatever it was that the Jews did in scheming to get rid of Jesus, Allah performed an even greater scheme and deception, because the Qur’an states:
[brackets used for focus points]
and for their saying, ‘We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messenger of God’ — yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, [only a likeness of that was shown to them]. Those who are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him; they have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they slew him not of a certainty — no indeed; S. 4:157 Arberry
And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger – they slew him not nor crucified him, [but it appeared so unto them]; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain. S. 4:157 Pickthall
That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Apostle of God”; – but they killed him not, nor crucified him, [but so it was made to appear to them], and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:- S. 4:157 Yusuf Ali
Who made people believe that Jesus died on the Cross although he was not crucified? Who managed to make it appear so? Allah. Allah performed a greater deception than even the enemies of Jesus who wanted him dead. And because of the deception of Allah, the majority of people believe until this day that Jesus died on the cross — according to the author of the Qur’an.” – answering-islam.org
You don’t need to convince me that Islam is wrong.
Despite what Bo and Dr. Brown think about me because I disagree with them about the gays, I am a Christian believer.
But, when one says, “Christianity is true” it is not a logical extension to say “… therefore Islam is wrong about everything.”
I sense that you agree with this — at least on the Muslim concept of God.
I, personally, don’t feel any need to defend Islam or the Quran. However I do feel that a lot of my fellow Christians bear false witness against Muslim people. I love the Muslim people and feel a need to defend them, when that happens.
Greg, I know you’re a Christian, I didn’t mean to give the wrong impression. I don’t think all Muslims are bad. They are not devoid of spirituality and morality. Many Muslims live decent lives and exhibit admirable devotion to God. I think we can draw the difference between Muslims and Islam. We both agree Islam is not true, but we acknowledge individual Muslims have a legitimate piety, in spite of the errors of their religion.
You probably couldn’t ignore my arguments with Bo about my dislike of “proof texting.”
So, even if you can find some obscure Quranic verse that calls God a “deceiver” — it’s not going to have much sway with me.
What interests me more is the major Quranic themes of God.
The one I hear — by far the most — is “Allahu Akbar.” Of course, it is associated with terrorism but, in the Muslim world everybody says it constantly. There is no religious expression in America that comes close. Not even “God bless you.”
I wasn’t talking about you! Some other people here have been extremely judgmental of me.
>>I think we can draw the difference between Muslims and Islam.
… and especially the Quran and Muslims.
Some Christians will search the Quran, find a violent verse, and claim that this is why all Muslims are so terrible.
But, many Muslims won’t even know that verse exists!
Some Muslims will do the say with our bible. They will find some violent passage (usually in the OT) and say this is why Christians are so terrible.
Have you ever met a Muslim who worships Jesus?
I have met more than a few.
They are Muslims, not Christians, but they actively worship the “second to the last” prophet.
They have a super-high veneration of Jesus but as a prophet, not the Son of God.
Even so, it hard not feeling a certain kinship with them.
It’s hardly obscure Greg. It is dealing with the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, something we should think was important.
I’ve never heard of a Muslim who “worships” Jesus, but if you say so… In any event, they’re not supposed to.
Yes, normally they venerate Jesus.
I would say that they have a very high, almost Catholic, view of Mary, too.
It’s also interesting that the author of the Qur’an also thought that Christians believed Mary was the third member of the Trinity. Its a very interesting study. James White does a great job discussing the Qur’ans view of the Trinity.
The Koran is so ambiguous, it’s almost impossible to ascertain what its author believed about the Trinity. Say not three, desist!
The 10-15% of Muslims being extremists is widely used by Middle Eastern scholars like Daniel Pipes and others, and it was the figure used by a Muslim Pakistani scholar I spoke with last week. As for Greg’s remark re: America, he made the false assumption that the numbers are that high in America, which they obviously are not. The figures would be far higher in countries like Pakistan and Afghanistan and Iran and in places like Gaza, etc. — far higher — making for the overall 10-15% estimate.
GregAllen:”I lived in Muslim countries for many years and I’d estimate the percentage of militants/radicals at around around 0.1%.”
While your request has been answered can you please give us how you came to your number? Hey, I find your number so absurd that I suppose youll next tell us Nebraska is a hotbed of radicalism too. I must say, keep trying.
How about judge the koran by its fruit. Can we all agree to that test. And before anyone starts reciting the horrors of everyone else, try to confine that list to just the last 50 years. And then tell us where Christianity was an essential part of their crime.
I think the Fruit Test is a good place to start.
I just reviewed a Pew institute survey and one interesting thing about it was the numbers of favor ability rating that Jews have in the middle east –
Egypt,Jordan,Syria,ect The Islam rating was in the 97 percent average, the Jewish was a low 2 percent of a positive view. What does this show? A very radical difference in these two peoples/and or religions. Greg, your .01 percent number is way out of sync for any way you would look at numbers including this Pew survey. I would agree with the P.H.d view of where these numbers are coming from. The positive view of this survey is that Christians had a bit higher view in the Middle east, but still a low number. There is a radical difference between the God of Israel, and the god of islam.
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