Pastor John MacArthur has announced a conference this fall focusing on “strange fire,” featuring noted speakers like R. C. Sproul. He claims that part of the charismatic movement “blasphemes the Holy Spirit” and “attributes to the Holy Spirit even the work of Satan.” Is this conference a good thing or a bad thing? Listen live here 2-4 pm EST, and call into the show at (866) 348 7884 with your questions and comments.
(In your comments, feel free to speak openly about the issues but do not attack individuals by name on either side of these issues.)
Hour 1:
Dr. Brown’s Bottom Line: If you want to be scriptural, hunger and thirst for everything that God has for His people and reject the counterfeit that does not line up with the Word of the Spirit!
Hour 2:
Dr. Brown’s Bottom Line: The Apostles and the early disciples could not minister without the power of the Spirit. We make a grave error when we think we can minister without the power of the Spirit!
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I hope the second hour plays because nothing is playing in SC for the first one.
They wrote back the other day and said I was running an outdated browser. I’m running IE-10 so that can’t be it. Anyone?
Man, missed the live stream 🙁
I hope to listen to it or read the basic summary of what was said soon!
It is the most serious allegation John MacArthur is making; I don’t think it is good for him to do that.
Perhaps, then, his less mature followers will start throwing the charge around carelessly. It just isn’t a good thing.
Sheila and anyone else having streaming problems. I tried something new today that worked since I too am having trouble playing the live stream from OnePlace.
I opened Windows Media Player. Click File and clicked Open URL… and I pasted in there: http://salemnet.ic.llnwd.net/stream/salemnet_op-line_of_fire
Clicked OK and it connected and played the live show through windows Media Player.
An honest question to Mike and any of my friends who speak in tongues. I personally am very uncomfortable speaking something in which I have no idea what I am saying. I also get chills of caution when listening to something no one can understand because you have no idea what is being said. If there is an interpereter then I would feel better.
I am not condemning tongues in anyway. So my question is: Do you personally know what you are saying when you are speaking in tongues? If I did not know what I was saying I would probably start praying to Jesus to deliver me from whatever I was saying because it would terrify me that I might be saying something I should not be.
I do not mean for this comment to open a can of worms, nor do I want it to be viewed as anti-tongues. This is just a question I have always wondered. The only friends I have who “spoke in tongues” told me they faked it to fit into the congregation they were attending, so I have not interacted with someone who has truly spoken in tongues, to inquire of them.
Thanks for answering my heart felt question.
Benjamin Warkentin,
Re: speaking in other languages (viz.: “divers” “tongues”)
I’d actually detected Hebrew when I was praising God in another language, and I looked up some of the words – and they had meaning!
Example:
“Micaiah” – “who is like unto our God?” or “who can be compared to our God?”
I’d never known what that word meant, but while we were praising God, I just started uttering it (among other words and phrases)!
Does that answer your question?
Benjamin,
There is a communion with God that is active and real, even if I don’t understand the words I am praying. Paul addresses this in 1 Cor 14:2, 4. So, my spirit is communing with God, my mind is active (even without understanding all that I am praying), and I am greatly edified, often getting clear direction in prayer after praying in tongues.
It grieves my heart to realize that thousands of young Christians are going to be taught that Charismatics are deceived and worse. These conferences are going to create even more division in the Body of Christ. Thank you Dr. Brown for this show. It would be great if you could present some teaching on how to properly respond to other Christians who approach us.
To disagree about the gifts are one thing, to not understand is one thing… but to comdem them in this manor with the conference is something different.
Mr. MacArthur in my view is walking a very thin line. The same claim he is making about it “blasphemy the Holy Spirit” is what he doing if he is wrong. (I believe he is wrong). The worse part is, he will be leading masses of other ppl to dis-credit the works of the Holy Spirit also.
Side note… this was a great show… will a listen link be posted?
So much info… I probably need to re-listen to make sure I catch all of it.
Thanks in advance
There have been many who have directly and indirectly attempted to address John MacArthur on the issue of supernatural manifestations of the Holy Spirit in church history and today. Here is one good article:
http://scholarscorner.com/Critical/Cessation
This topic is painful for me- My first exposure to John McArthur as a new believer was an attempt (without grace or love) by someone close to me to force me away from groups that experience gifts such as tongues, prophesy, healings, using John McA as a platform. Yet, by God’s grace, I have come to deeply appreciate much of what John MacA. brings from the scriptures. However, I am convinced he is far off target on this issue, and has come to the topic with a pre-concieved dogma that there are no (or at least very few) supernatural manifestations of the HS today.
We must of course own the fact that many false teachings and shocking practices have been associated with “pentecostal” and “charismatic” movements. I use quotations because I am even loathe to identify these as some sort of divisions; can Christ be divided? (of course not!).
However, these are issues that have and will persist because of human imperfection. The Apostle Paul clearly had to address problems with the gifts in the churches from the very beginning! This is not a cause to reject but to pray, humble ourselves, and call on the Lord to bring holiness, gentleness, wisdom; and yet also more powerful works to His Glory!
I myself am both mystified by those who seem to genuinely teach the cessation of gifts or the miraculous; but also brought to pray and intercede for the church, that indeed Christ’s spirit would work unity and amazing grace among us; that the world would see and say, “behold, how they love one another.”
So let’s be moved to prayer, fasting, and crying out to God that He might bring our brothers and sisters who carry on conferences such as these to be filled with conviction and humble recognition of the power and sovereign (yet gentle) workings of our Lord today. Maybe even during this conference itself! That the true work of God would be glorified, and people would be saved in power, working of wonders, and amazing transformation of lives.
Then we can most fully enjoy our fellowhsip together for eternity with Him.
Another discussion in the form of a letter addressed in love to John McA directly. From the website, sadly no reply was received.
http://www.christian-oneness.org/essays/macarthur.html
I appreciate the careful and conciliatory manner that the letter was written, building common ground while still refuting the position that John McA had taken.
Thanks, MattB for the link to the essay. I too enjoyed the tone of Ian Johnson’s civil and comprehensive response – whether you agree or not with his position. I saved it as a model for how to disagree without being disagreeable. I have a simple response to John MacArthur’s position: he seems to be doing what so many human beings do in error: Throwing out the proverbial baby with the bathwater.
Why not invite John MacArthur on on the Line of Fire to address these issues. I love MacArthur and am on his mailing list and regularly get his teachings. However I am a pentecostal. However I boldly agree with John in rejecting the word of faith movement and prosperity gospel. When it’s taught that Jesus had to be born again in hell or that Christians become little gods I reject that heresy as a teaching another Jesus and a different Gospel. When I hear a statement from one of these so called pentecostal TV preachers and have to ask myself are they MacArthur will come on to discuss these things.
John, generally speaking, folks with major ministry platforms of their own will not come on someone else’s radio show to debate issues like this, but I’m making efforts to see if he’s willing to have a public debate on the gifts of the Spirit being for today.
I read “Charismatic Chaos” many years ago after I was introduced to the gifts of the Holy Spirit in Bible college. I wanted to here the other side of the story. There was much in the book that I agreed with. However, as a young Christian I was amazed at how he took scriptures out of context to support his views.
This debate saddens me. Paul could not have been more clear in 1 Corinthians 12-14. These chapters are really not complicated unless we try to force it to fit our experiences. Both sides of the debate are guilty of deliberately disobeying clear teaching of the scriptures. This disobedience directly leads to division in the body.
Many churches I have fellowshipped in disobey the scripture by forbidding to speak in tongues and by denying that the Holy Spirit can distribute the gifts as “He wills”.
Other churches ignore Paul and everyone is praying in tongues at once. This makes for a very uncomfortable environment for Christians who do not have that gift or for anyone to invite a non believer to. In many places you pastors/ leaders making a mockery of true faith by encouraging people to confess healings in the name of Christ when they were never healed.
I am greatly concerned with limiting the power of the Holy Spirit. I am greatly concerned with charismatics ignoring the Word of God, thinking everything that comes to mind is a prophecy, and the seriously flawed ideas concerning faith.
I really do not know what side is worse. If we just submit to clear teaching of scripture, much of the division would go away.
God hates the division. The power and gifts of the Holy Spirit should be drawing us to the scriptures, not away from them.
Thank you Dr. Brown for discussing these issues and approaching the scriptures in a straightforward way.
Blessings,
Peter
I would agree that the Bible teaches that the gifts continue. On the other hand I don’t see much discernment about the gifts even in the best of charismatic churches. If someone came in and said they had a prophecy but instead just said a nice message about the church that they made up would any church detect his false prophecy? It seems to me that a lack of discernment is the reason for the overreaction against the gifts.
Doug, every charismatic church I work with closely takes discernment of prophecy seriously, just for the record.
Grace and peace to you all. I’ve yet to listen to the show which I’ve just downloaded, but this is an issue I have been thinking through recently. Actually a study of James recently brought me to examine 1 Corinthians 13 (specifically mirrors) and what it has to say about the endurance of gifts. Here are some thoughts I wrote out looking at this:
“1 Corinthians 13 is the love chapter; however it falls in a section “concerning spiritual gifts” (12:1) in which Paul deals with problems these Christians were encountering regarding the Spirit’s design in administering various miraculous gifts. Love is shown as a more excellent way worthy of everyone’s pursuit (12:31; 14:1). In the discussion Paul contrasts the lasting power of love with the gifts which will cease (13:8). These gifts…prophesy, tongues, knowledge give only a partial picture of God’s will (13:9), as a child rather than a man (13:11), and as seeing in a mirror dimly rather than face to face (13:12). The partial seen in these gifts would be replaced by the perfect, the complete, the mature (13:10 look at these contrasts: partial/perfect, child/man, dim mirror/face to face), in which we can see, know fully, and be fully known (13:12). In this time the gifts are no longer needed (13:8, 10), but (13:13) now abides faith (compare 2 Cor 4:18 and 5:7 with 1 John 3:2), hope (Romans 8:24-25), and the greatest (by endurance), love. See the power God’s word has always had: James 1:23-25 does not speak of a dim mirror as in 1 Cor 13:12, but of the perfect (same word as 1 Cor 13:10) law of liberty, which in active hearing and doing transforms our image into exactly what God would have us to be. He brings us forth through the word of truth (James 1:18) and so works in us (see other passages like Phil 1:6; 2:12-13; Col 3:16).”
Beyond these simple notes consider the apostolic ministry of prayer and laying on hands used as a common pattern in administering these gifts in Acts 8:14ff. Philip was performing powerful signs in Samaria (8:6-8) and his preaching was believed (8:12-13), among these who believed was Simon who of course recognized how his works which once amazed the crowds fell short of the Spirit’s work in Philip, and so he was constantly amazed. Yet don’t the next verses dealing with Peter and John’s journey to meet these new Samaritan Christians imply that they and not Philip had a special authority in working with the Spirit to impart gifts? Surely on two occasions (Acts 2 and 10) the Spirit Himself fell on the apostles and on Cornelius’s household resulting in tongue speaking (which Acts 2:4-11 makes clear were living languages spoken and understood by the people come into Jerusalem for the feast. And note their inquiry in vs. 12, “What does this mean?” Something much greater than the sign..salvation accomplished in the Risen Lord Jesus Messiah! To the Jew first, Acts 2, and then to the Greek, Acts 10). And Paul is filled with the Spirit through the laying on of Ananias’s hands in Acts 9:17, though I’m not certain gifts are in view (he is then baptized 9:18, 22:16 as is Cornelius and all 10:47-48, which with 2:38 and 19:1-7 could say something of water and Spirit coming together as was Prophesied by Isaiah, Ezekiel, Zechariah, etc.) But if Acts 8 reveals the normal pattern, who then did God extend this authority to after the apostles deaths? And with the faith once and for all delivered (Jude 3), a salvation spoken, confirmed, and born witness to by signs, wonders, various miracles and gifts of the Holy Spirit according to His own will (Heb 2:3-4)…is our need for these specific gifts the same today as is was in the first century when these facts of Jesus’s ministry, death, burial and resurrection and establishment of His church where unveiled before the world’s eyes?
Finally the nature and magnitude of the gifts spoken of in Jesus’s earthly ministry and the apostles ministry are without parallel in history. Is what you read in the Gospels and in Acts what you see with your own eyes and experience today? Dead raised? Lame and paralyzed and blind and deaf being instantly and perfectly healed? I know there are many claims…but none that truthfully come close to the works Jesus and His apostles worked where even unbelievers had no cause of denial (John 5, 6, 9; 11:47; Acts 2:22; 4:14 etc.)
This is the rough conclusion of my studies at the moment. I await your critiques.
May God bless you,
David
@Dr. Brown, what was the name of that clip where they were crying out to Money?
We should all be crying out to God, not to Mammon!
David, you can search for it on YouTube (“money cometh to me”).
Re: “money cometh”
I bear witness: I’ve LITERALLY walked into a church, and that was one of their opening prayers – “money cometh: come here MONEY! Come here money! Come here money!” Like a mantra.
Dr. Brown,
“Money Cometh”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oXhYVm2MW8
Thanks Dr. Brown and Dan1el.
@Dr. Brown, if gold dust and precious metals (diamonds and others) appeared in a service would that be the work of God or lying wonders of the enemy?
I personally know some people who have had that happen to them and still have the precious metals.
Is God letting Satan test them for their love of these things and how much power they will give to these things, to see if their heart is truly for God or not?
David Roberts,
It all depends upon what their words are – if they are leading you to another God, it is a lying sign and wonder; if not, then it is a confirmation of the Word they publish and the God they say men must worship.
God also confirms Truth – even if it is a portion of Truth mixed in with some non-Truth (as long as the non-Truth does not contradict some *essential* Truth) – as He does with Calvinists, who have imperfect doctrine but have the witness of the Spirit in themselves confirming some Truths they affirm.
It doesn’t mean everything they say is correct; it could mean a portion – or of their heart-direction – of their words are true.
Thank you for the show.
Craig Keener addresses why we do not see healing miracles in the Western World today, in his book on Miracles. Re the passage about things passing away, knowledge is included in that list. I doubt any preacher would say that knowledge disappeared with the closing of the canon!
Moreover, the people who don’t believe in the gifts don’t go to churches where the gifts are handled responsibly. So they have no chance to see what goes on. To be fair, most of us are too busy in our home churches to go elsewhere.
PS Mr MacArthur has strong opinions, but this conference seems designed to offend — it’s not really his style. Some men on his team are more full on that he is, perhaps he has been advised to do this by his coworkers?
PPS I read Dr Brown’s article on the Charisma site. Well done, Dr B!
Hello Anthea,
Yes, knowledge is in that list in 1 Cor 13:8-10. What type of knowledge? Specifically the word of knowledge, or utterance of knowledge given by the Spirit (1 Cor 12:9; also 14:6). Paul says this, which is partial or knowing only in part, will cease when the perfect comes 1 Cor 13:10. Is it not logical that if this knowledge is imparted today, then today the canon is not closed? The word of God nearly 2000 years after the crucial events in history took place has not been completed and sent to the saints as Jude says?
If you get back to this, would you mind clarifying what you mean in this paragraph: “Moreover, the people who don’t believe in the gifts don’t go to churches where the gifts are handled responsibly. So they have no chance to see what goes on. To be fair, most of us are too busy in our home churches to go elsewhere.”
If it were only the first sentence I’d have to ask whether you think 1 Cor 12-14 presents a picture of a church at Corinth that was handling gifts responsibly? But on a second reading I don’t think I got what you’re communicating.
God Bless,
David
If the church in Corinth was rebuked for “doing it wrong”, it would imply that there were other churches who were doing it right. And that’s the point. some people say that they went here or there and saw this or that being done badly in a church, and generalise. But it’s very hard, if we are faithful and busy in our home churches, to get involved with a careful scouting mission to check out what is happening in fellowships of a different stripe.
Remember, we must test all experiences by the word of God and not the reverse. I believe if there are manifestations that can’t be found in scripture then we need to reject it. The bible is not the final athority it is the ONLY athority. that being said I also belive that the gifts are for today.
John, what do you think of what Jonathan Edwards said about this? http://askdrbrown.org/great-comments-by-jonathan-edwards-on-revival-discernment/
Dr. Brown,
You seem to have a willingness to count sheep before they have run the race or passed the test. Jesus in Mt. 7 exposes the dangers of false teachers after some of the most scary warning s about false believers “never knowing Him”. Paul in Acts 20 warned the Ephesian elders to be careful in guarding the flock of God against those who would rise among even their own church.
Question: Does that wanring at all resonate with you as you count and recount into the coffers of the Charismatic movement the souls of those millions who profess Christ as a result of the Charismatic movement?
In reading the account where Jesus identifies “Blashpemy of the Holy Spirit”, where John get it wrong (very surprising he missed this), is that Christ identified it as attributing to Satan the work of the Holy Spirit, not the other way around. This is such a basic reading that a man with John’s time in should see it. But, when you wear blinders or special glasses (such as Calvanistic views), I guess you can overlook anything. It seems that he is more closely approaching the blasphemy. While I agree that there are many abuses, such as Paul saw in Corinth, there are very real manifestations of the gifts, which include teaching.
I graduated with John from Bob Jones University. It is hard for him to speak of something he has not experienced. I received my gift of tongues in 1976 and have found it to be a source of wonderful communication with God and tuning my spirit into the voice of the Holy Spirit. As the apostle Paul said, “I speak in tongues more than you all..” He that speaks in a tongue speaketh unto God in mysteries. What most evangelicals don’t understand is that there are different kinds of supernatural tongues. 1) Languages, such as spoken at Pentecost to the Jews from many nations as a sign, 2) unknown tongues spoken at the Gentile Pentecost at Cornelius’s home in Antioch, 3)personal edification tongues spoken to minister back to God to build you up in your Spirit. Paul also said, “I will speak with understanding and with my spirit also..” Not all tongues can be understood as they are the language of the Holy Spirit. Why would God give a gift of the devil to those seeking to know Him better… interesting! “If an earthly father knows how to give good gifts to his children, how much more will the heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask Him”. God bless!
Is there any discerning Christians out there that is going to be like a Barean and check everything out by the word of God? In 2Cor. 11:12-15 was the same thing that Paul was dealing with in his day. There were those who desire an apportunity to be regarded just as we are in the things of which they boast. He called then false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ, and no wonder for Satan himself transforms himself into a angel of light, therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into iministers of righteousness, who end will be according to their works.
Did he divide the church? The church was being defined in that day as it is in our day. Thanks be to God that those who are standing and contending and defending the faith are the ones that we need to thank God for, not those who are taking all the money from those that they can get and live in big houses, with all the worlds goods and care nothing about the soul of a man. The true church is those who worship God in the Spirit, glory in Christ and take no confidence in te flesh.
Wake up!!! God is bringing a judgment and it starts with His people first and if it is with difficulty that we are saved, what will it be for the unrighteous and unholy as they face their judgment. God in no mocked and this movement is a mockery and should be to all God fearing redeemed ones an insult to the Grace of GOD!!
I am praying for this stand that they have taken and hope by the grace of God some will be rescued from this manmade religion.
Sober warning,
Judie
Appreciate Dr. Brown’s ministry on many subjects very much, I want you all to know this.
Well here I am. 35 years a Charismatic. I have prophesied, spoken in many different types of tongues, driven out demons, discerned thoughts, seen into the souls of people at select times, worked on the mission field, taught the bible, studied, studied, studied – you name it. Being saved in Kathryn Kuhlman’s ministry I loved Benny Hinn but not many of the others. (K. Kuhlman’s services were all done in an orderly and very dignified manner and she preached a true salvation message.)
Yep. Been there, did that all that until the Lord straightened me out.
Wow! It HURT, HURT, HURT. It was devastating. It took the Lord about 6 weeks of reasoning in the word to be free from 35 years of seeing the world from a charismatic viewpoint. And the Lord reasoned with me (Isa. 1:26) through the word.
The real high point clincher was when within my thoughts I asked myself “Is the Word of God complete?” and I answered within myself “Yes!” And I asked again “Is God adding more gospel revelation to His church outside of what is given?” The answer was of course, “No!” Then the conclusion came: “So what am I doing when I say ‘thus saith the Lord’ or even imply it?” The conviction that came to my soul at that time caused me to fall to the floor on my knees and mourn for weeks! He broke my heart and mended it again. I had to rebuild my theology all over.
Been free now for 10+ years and am not going back. Have come into great fruitfulness by God’s grace ministering to 100s on the internet who would never know or hear of the things of God otherwise. My mind is clear. My appreciation of Christ’s atonement is sublime and ever growing. The glory I give to the gospel of my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ administered to me by the Holy Spirit!
Now I pray with my understanding and know if there are things I don’t understand the Holy Spirit is interceding for me anyway with groanings that cannot be uttered since God hears the words of the High Priest at His right side. I trust His providence as never before. All anxiety over lack of miracles in church services is gone. Trust in God is as total as it has ever been and growing. Peace of God in my heart is beyond understanding. Glory!
Thank God for the teaching in MacArthur’s conference and book. I can say that I agree with MacArthur and “I am the man” – I have blasphemed the Holy Spirit* in the past by attributing to Him what He had not said. He has forgiven me even though I cannot fathom why since my sin was so great. *I am totally aware that this is not the same as the Pharisaical sin since I confessed Christ as Lord and Saviour at the same time, unlike them.
I know both positions in and out through experience and doctrine. I know which view is based in the word and corroborated by church history. Ain’t going back. So all the defences of the extraordinary gifts I have heard since I held them myself, good people. I want no harm to come to anyone. Just thought it was good if someone who knows both sides spoke up.
May God bless us all with a deeper understanding of His truth.
‘Reformers’ have led us to today’s ‘charismania’ prophetic, much of which is based upon a false eschatology (being ‘angelic’, sent ‘delusionary’ FORCE, by G-d, of that which consistently DENIES the ‘resurrection ORDER’, from here, as ENTIRELY IN THE FLESH, as fallen same ‘dna’ from first Adam, yet facing from here a ‘second death’ to all those not already, from here as already been declared ‘twice dead’, plucked up’, declared by G-d from their very ‘roots’, that of their own, once enjoyed, humanity of the ‘born again’, of both soul and spiritual BODY connection of the ‘inner man’, of this ‘initial life’ only of a ‘twice born’ APOSTATE, who has already played the ‘fool’, having played ‘havoc’ within the promised buildup of the Harlot Church, leading up unto these heavens SUDDENLY on REAL fire, ending, of all human soul life in this ‘initial’ intro to eternal existence somewhere in the vast, ever expanding, MATERIALLY never ending Universe, ‘of HIS’) for it was the Reformers that continued the false teachings of the Harlot Church PROMISED buildup THAT PAUL was saying he would be ‘bodiless’ from here, RATHER than his clear statement ‘he would far rather’ be ‘absent’ from His hidden within soul BODY (AS IN INSTANTANIOUS CHANGE rapture of the ‘human SPIRITUAL body’) first as in his worship here separating, rightly dividing ‘soul and spirit’, BUT also in his explaining first the ‘angels’ take our soul BODY from here to await our own order of resurrection from here (and not until having arrived ‘through’ heavenly Paradise unto the very portals of Heaven beyond the ‘third heaven’ as OVERCOMERS will the ‘midnight cry’ go forth to ‘come up hither’ BUT reserved for ONLY those of the overcoming, yet ‘as those youthful’ exampled ‘ten’ WHO “MADE THEMSELVES READY” as practicing ‘virgins’ BEYOND the ‘third heaven’ where Paul was given ‘vision’ of what his ‘journey’ from this ‘initial life’ AND THE NEXT, takes him BEYOND even heavenly Paradise which is clearly BEYOND the ‘third’ heaven AND Jerusalem “above” (not to be confused with the ‘New Jerusalem’ YET TO COME DOWN UPON A Jerusalem “above” of which was described by John THRU open door ‘portals’ into heaven itself as on a flattened mountain top some approx. 1,500 miles square, it’s height EQUALLY, totally, ‘level’. showing a minimal ‘curvature’, as if similar to our known ‘size’ of our Jupiter, of what our present day now ‘seen’ spheres in first heavens can be ‘size’ compared, for our ‘edification’) much of which could also have come, or could now come, also to the Reformers, in ‘personal humble edification’ prayer, even in the ‘language of angels’, UNKNOWN as to ANY of men’s tongues, used in communication, on this tiny footstool of HIS
an interesting ‘footnote’ to Strange Fire Conference history, past ‘Charismatic Chaos Literature’ published by leadership of Grace to You (the ‘Charismatic Foursquare’ under Jack Hayford leadership of large congregants down the street from ‘Grace to You’, offered and was accepted by MacArthur financial ‘aid’ to the famous lawsuit by parents of a young ‘Grace to You’ parishioner who had committed suicide after coming to BELIEVE ‘absent from the body’ is to be instantaneously present with the Lord FROM HERE) tying together the false eschatology of the Reformers with Charismatic adoption of clearly false Reformed ‘eschatology’ (in which Paul instead TORAH ‘taught’ New Covenant as ENLIGHTNED continuation of the Old, as unto RESURRECTION ‘of the FLESH’ FROM here, some however unto ‘eternal damnation’, SOME however unto ‘eternal life’ FROM their ‘NEXT’ life, as confirmed by Messiah Jesus Christ of Nazareth WHO taught “NEXT” life, from here, would also be life IN FALLEN SINFUL FLESH of BOTH first, LAST Adam, in which ALL manner of BLASPHEMY against F-ther and Son ‘then, there’, CAN BE FORGIVEN with true ‘repentence’, but that of which continuation of ‘blasphemy’ against Holy Spirit cannot, be forgiven then, THERE either) of which TRUE ‘good news’ (‘gospel’ of BOTH Messiah Jesus Christ, also of Paul) is of ‘resurrection’ IN THE FLESH and a ‘next life PROMISED’ before eternal judgment is decreed upon human beings WITH THE EXCEPTION of those declared already by G-d ‘ALREADY’ FROM LIFE ON THIS INITIAL INTRO TO ETERNAL EXISTENCE, AS ‘TWICE dead’, NAMES ERASED ALREADY FROM ANY ‘BOOK OF LIFE’, plucked up by the very ‘roots’ of once enjoyed humanity UNTO eternal judgment from here, as having been twice born, BUT now, declared already as experienced a second DEATH, already, in just one life lived out in very same likeness, of very same FALLEN first Adam ‘sinful flesh’, that of BOTH Adams, first and Last, the Last so very briefly compared to the resurrected ‘first’ Adam example of longevity of resurrection NEXT life potential, WHEN A CHILD IS CONSIDERED STILL A ‘CHILD’, age 100 in ‘years