Was Jesus a Liberal? By lofradio Feb 16, 2011 / 26 Comments Tweet https://thelineoffire.org/shows/line_of_fire_02_16_11_hr1.mp3 [Download MP3] Scotty McLennan Book on Jesus the Liberal The Manhattan Declaration AbortionNo Website (Warning: Graphic Content)
1) Scotty is a follower of Jesus.
2) Scotty is pro-choice.
3) I gather that Scotty believes Jesus is pro- choice?
I read Jeremiah 1:5 and it couldn’t be more clear to me. “I knew you before you were formed in the womb.” That means to me that God knows our spirits before we are even formed in the womb. I used to believe like Scotty that it wasn’t my business. I believe it’s God’s though. As the CHURCH are God’s hands and feet. My God isn’t pro-choice. He brought me to that conclusion around two years ago. Everywhere I turned he was pelting me with proof after proof that abortion wasn’t his plan. Now I stand peacefully outside abortion clinics hoping that my presence will save just one child. I also donate money to the Women’s Help Centers in my area. They find alternatives to baby killing. God bless Scotty. I pray God gives him the same revelation as I received.
Today’s show brought to my mind a question that I can’t seem to answer. I do have some understanding why women like Jennifer Knust would take such a contradictory position to themselves she has done. It is called the “Eve Affect”. What I don’t understand is why men in particular will place themselves in competition with God. They may fall in love with Christ and come to him as his child for these things they profess to do and be, but at the same time, they act as if they are now at the same divine level as God. They perceived themselves now endowed with the ability to change the meaning of the Word or they are now possessed with divine facilities that they want others to worship them for. (I’m not referring to today’s guest) I see it within many Christian men, maybe they don’t take it as far as a Jim Jones or a David Koresh, but the trait is definitely there. Why?
@Pamela, Generally such behavior stems from self importance and arrogance. Alot of men are taught to behave like an alpha male Wolf or other animal from a very early age. Others feel inadequate and make up for this feeling through narsistic behaviors. It all boils down to how one is taught to view the world and were he places himself in it. I personally am guilty of falling into the second trap, but thanks be to God, he broke me down in order to rebuild me.
Dr. Brown, I would have to take issue with this guest on several accounts, I do however appreciate the attitude with which you confronted him. That being said, I have to wonder what this man’s concept of Sin is. The Bible is pretty plain (at least to me) that both Homosexuality and Abortion are in fact sinful behavior. Is he unaware of the fact that God hates Sin and that Sin is the root cause of all problems in human society? Is he unaware of the fact that God never changes? If Jesus Equates Lust with a sin deserving the death penality under Mosaic Law, How can he as a “Christian” ok homosexual acts? How can Homosexuality once be classified as Sexual Immorality but now isn’t? God certainly didn’t change his mind on the issue.
I wonder if too many men were taught that they are to be leaders. I wish they were judges instead, doing justice and judgment, fairness and equity, without partiality and without hypocrisy.
Or, is that being too conservative for today’s society?
Thank you Cliff! I’ll keep that in mind when I encounter one of those alpha male Christians again. They seem to find it hard to believe or understand that God is my DIRECT BOSS! I don’t like being in friction with other professed Christians, but such a wedge gets driven in when they realized that I really mean what I say. God was the one who put me where I’m at; therefore I only take orders from Him – not from any man! Only God should govern any divine gift He has given to us. I’m starting to realized that as we draw nearer to Christ’s second coming, we, Christians, are going to be bestowed with some very awesome and very amazing divine gifts to use in our ministry for Him, and as a result, I know that satanically driven people will try to gain control over us for those very abilities. That’s exactly what they did to Christ. They weren’t seeking a miracle for themselves, but wanted to force Him to perform a miracle in their demand.
What a show! With todays guest there is so much to comment on that it would be difficult, once I start to post, to end…I believe I need to be blessed with the same amount of restraint that Dr. Brown showed throughout…I bet a young Mike Brown newly minted by the Lord would have torn Scotty to pieces, but then what kind of a host would he have made.The way I see it, I now have a new person that I can genuinely pray for…that I pray that Dr. Scotty have a regenerative reconciliation event with the RISEN Lord Jesus Christ; the very same event that Jesus spoke about in John 3:3-21, this man, regardless of what he may personally claim,is hurtin, I believe, and suffice to say is on a dangerous path,scripturally speaking !!
I am always amazed by how simple and basic God made the gospel message..and equally amazed by how often the WISE,the over-educated, the pointy-headed miss it,replacing that BASE message with their OWN humanistic type approach…whatever!…Why does not Dr.Brown suffer from what I just described? He was SAVED before his education !!…I will stop now,though I can go on for 10-15,000 more words easily,this show was so eye-opening…God bless Dr.Brown and Dr.Scotty…
I just wanted to point out that you can swing that idea too far in the other direction. We need to take orders from men and women of God. No we don’t take orders from them in violating the word of God, but spiritual authority is put in place by God for our benifit. Timothy took orders from Paul in Scripture. Elisha took orders from Elijah. Ruth from Naomi, etc. God said to obey the governing authorities, that includes in the body of Christ also. Why? Because humility, meekness, and submission are attributes of God himself and He desires us to be like Him. Why? Because inheritence is passed from a Father to a Son (positional term, not term of gender)….You want to surround yourself with trusted men and women of God that you can submit to and serve because it wasn’t until Elisha served Elijah that the anointing fell on Him.
Yes God is going to give some amazing gifts and the global outpouring of the Spirit is going to get more intense as we draw closer to the Return of our Bridegroom, but that anointing is going to come to men and women who are seeking God with their whole heart and are under spiritual authority.
Scripture says that unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies it abides alone, but if it falls into the ground and dies it produces much fruit.
A seed has to go down and be covered. Only then can in grow towards the sun (Son) and produce fruit. You have to get under a covering of authority. And the seed is covered with dirt showing you that all of your authority may not be perfect and may have some dirty spots, but you stay humble and serve with meekness and let the Lord grow you in the anointing and produce incredible fruit.
I just wanted to point that out.
Pamela, Cliff and Joseph: as a fellow Christian, I take offense to your comments about the Rev. Dr. McLennan as well as your narrow view of Christianity and the Gospel.
The Jesus whom many of us know and love is compassionate and tolerant, an advocate of freedom from authority, and a believer in the inherent dignity of all people, whether they be tax collectors or prostitutes.
The Bible can be read literally, but we know that the Gospels have different authors, messages and were written at differen times. Many Christians understand the Bible to be allegorical and metaphorical. Read any scientific records of fact and it is obvious that the Earth was not created in 6 days, as the Holy Book says. Clearly, this is a metaphor.
Lastly, from the prior comments, I hear an unhealthy obsession & belief that we should judge other Christians as if we were God himself. Just as you judge the Rev. Dr. McLennan, so too may others judge you. But I hear others say, and I will say, leave that to the Lord. Whether or not you can see it, I believe God respects and honors McLennan’s loyalty and faith to Him. Shame on you for judging another based on your narrow and intolerant approach to faith, and for bringing about animosity toward a fellow Christian. We should build each other up, not tear each other down. Have some humility and realize that you are neither omniscient nor omnipotent, no matter how much you wish to be so.
A baby in the womb takes in oxygenated blood through the umbilical cord. How does this make the baby in the womb any less alive or any less human than a baby outside the womb? The Bible says that a creatures life is in its blood.
Not so, Matt! God is my direct Boss! Meaning that I seek to follow and obey his directions and guidance even when I do not have a complete understanding as to the why. Many times that understanding comes after the fact, just like I cannot realize the exceeding wickedness of sin until after I came out of them through pure obedience to God’s will. But as for dealing with other people, they must use the method of persuasion. Meaning they must have solid convincing or compelling reason why I should comply with whatever they are requesting. If they have been successful in the truthfulness of their persuasion of me, then the Bible gives us this advice…
And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also. And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away. Matthew 5:40-42
In our convictions to do a good thing or paying a restitution for our wrongs, we should go beyond what was required of us according to our Lord, but I’m not a blind follower of men!
Nope! You’ll never see me in that crowd!
But Peter and John answered and said unto them, Whether it be right in the sight of God to hearken unto you more than unto God, judge ye. Acts 4:19
In addition ~ Rebecca,
Don’t these people realize that they are messing with God’s heritage?
Lo, children are an heritage of the LORD: and the fruit of the womb is his reward. Psalm 127:3
At the moment of conception, it is a fruit!
God has spoken!!!
First of all, Kana Kamehameha, why is that man, Mr. McLennan using a title that belongs to God ALONE?
He sent redemption unto his people: he hath commanded his covenant for ever: holy and reverend is his name. Psalm 111:9
Since I can’t get pass the unauthorized use of a divine name, therefore I’m unable to hear anything that MR. McLennan has to say – PERIOD!
I am now going to make your day! 🙂 You stated…. “That the Earth was not created in 6 days, as the Holy Book says. Clearly, this is a metaphor.”
Well, the other day the Lord had me do a study in Genesis. The creation was created in 6 days. I will show you the proof in the Lord’s word. I am so excited to share this with you.
In Genesis 1:5,8,13,19,23,31
Check out all these verses. They all said in it. “So the evening and the morning were the. After each day God created it said, So the evening and the morning were the 1st Day, then the 2ND day, then 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th day.
By stating the evening and morning after each event in that day was created showed that it was created in a 24 hour period.
In the 3rd day Genesis 1:12-13 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. And evening passed and morning came, marking the third day.
He made all the fruits and vegetables, seeds. Well, there was no sunlight made yet. Fruits and vegetables can not grow if there is no sunshine. So, Day 4 God (In genesis 1:16-19) created the sun for light during the day, and the stars and moon for light at night.
The sun was created 1 day after the fruits and vegetables. If the days were created thousands of years apart how could the fruits and vegetable and seeds survive?
So that is that. The Lord created the world in 6 days. Rested on the 7th.
Kana may the Lord pour His blessings and favor upon you. I hoped my post shed some revelation and understanding to you.
Why do you place your faith in science more so than scripture? Do you think that man was made in the image of YHWH, or do you think that man evolved. If you believe both, then you think that the immutable YHWH evolved, don’t you? A bit paradoxical, don’t you think?
The liberal position holds man and his knowledge above YHWH and His revelation. This is why the liberal position is not compatible with the gospel.
The liberal position places man in the position of YHWH. It worships the creation instead of the creator. It says it worships the creator, but its creator has been created in the image of man.
No accusation or judgment intended, just a simple observation. The conservative position has its problems too.
You wrote that Jesus was “a believer in the inherent dignity of all people, whether they be tax collectors or prostitutes.” Perhaps you missed the fact that He died for these very people — and you and me — because of human sin and rebellion, not affirming us in our sins (be those sins prostitution or extortion or pride) but saving us from our sins.
I tend to miss that point all too often.
Bo and Dr. Brown: thank you for your comments. You both have expressed a willingness to hear other perspectives that you may not share, and I respect you for that. As Christians, we need to be tolerant of others even when we disagree with their beliefs.
First, your point about the word “reverend” is atypical. Do you mean to say that men like the Reverend Billy Graham and the Reverend Rick Warren have also taken an “unauthorized use of a divine name?” In the majority of Christian churches, when a minister is ordained, he is given the title “Reverend.” So, I’m not sure on what basis you make your claim.
Second, I will respond to your declaration: “since I can’t get pass the unauthorized use of a divine name, therefore I’m unable to hear anything that MR. McLennan has to say – PERIOD!” (a confusing use of the present tense, by the way – “get pass”). Your point merely reinforces what I’ve already said. Your judgments based on your narrow and intolerant approach to faith, and your animosity toward a fellow Christian, are offensive. Consequently, I cannot take your assertions seriously.
Thanks for your gracious comments, which I appreciate. When you have the time, I’d be curious to hear your actual response to the point I made in my post.
The whole idea of whether Christians should be conservatives or republicans was nicely addressed by government professor J.Budziszewski in his book “The Revenge of Conscience”. A great read where he not only discusses the moral law, but also why no government system (conservative or liberal) can and should ever teach virtue. He makes the point that such things are best left to the church and family. He makes the point that both conservative and liberal governments are fraught with problems from the Christian Kingdom vantage point. It’s a good read that has been recently reprinted.
Can the humuhumunukunukuapua’a survive the wave if the turtle can’t? 🙂
How do we know when to take the scripture literally? Is it our own likes and dislikes and/or cultural norms that dictate the accuracy of a literal interpretation? Can we know more for sure that science is correct than a literal interpretation of any given scripture? In what or who do we really put our faith? In the consensus of men? In the testimony of YHWH? In our own reason?
Just wondering if you are still out there. Is there a “scientific”, objective system or at least a logical system to use to know when to believe the consensus of scientists over the obvious statements of the Bible…or is it subjective and cultural?
Your criticism of me means nothing to me. Your very futile endeavor to exert control over someone through a form is laughable to say the least.
This relates to Bo’s response to Kana and the dependability of science.
Some are questioning the validity of Einstein’s relativity:
How dependable is science?
Some might contend that science can explain how fermentation takes place is the process of wine making.
I would say that that is usually so. But can science always explain how wine is made?
Before we answer that question we might want to read John 2:1-10.
Can science really explain how thousands can be fed with a few fishes and loaves of bread?
God performs wonders that cannot be fathomed, miracles that cannot be counted. (Job 5:9 NIV)
As my audio is downloading, I looked up the word Liberal in my dictionary. Jesus was liberal in how he gave of himself for our salvation, giving freely and being generous. In that sense he was the greatest of Liberals.
But there are other senses of the word liberal.
In other uses of the word liberal, he doesn’t seem to fit very well in my opinion.
Jesus is liberal in the sense of abundance, as in a liberal reward.
But is he tolerant of views differing from his own? He bears with us knowing our nature and weaknesses, giving us time to repent. In that sense he’s tolerant of others.
When I hear some of the things said by some who say they are pro-choice about abortion, I can’t help but think of Pontius Pilate who gave Jesus over to the people and let them decide what should be done to him.
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