Glen Beck’s “Back to God” Rally: Good or Bad for America and the Church? By lofradio Aug 30, 2010 / 62 Comments Tweet https://thelineoffire.org/shows/line_of_fire_08_30_10_hr1.mp3 Glen Beck as a Conservative Christian Leader? Divine Destiny Rally Beck Rally “Not So Lilly White”
I believe that Christ has to be the head, of the heart, the mind, the person, the life, the meeting, the doctrine, the kingdom within a person a people, and in area of their lives,any mixture,or compromise, is confusion, and is not of God.the thing happening or the meeting is either God or its NOT.Point is Christ is the head, if He is not its not God or of God.Mixture is never in the flow if God. God Is not the author of confusion.
I agree with the first two people that called in.Not only is glen beck a mormon but much of what he says is hate filled.We should be very weary of glen beck.He breeds hate.I heard him one time talking in a little girls voice as if he was one of obamas little girls talking to obama[her dad].Beck was mocking the child as well as the president. It was very,very disturbing.I would like to see a revivel,a turning back to God in our country.But I don’t believe glen beck will be leading it.We christians should be careful of anything glen beck is a part of.
I will by the grace of Father God never agree to confusion.Anything with two heads is a freak.Someone who is a Mormon who is NOT IN Christ by choice and chooses not to be IN Christ,is not part of the same body i’m In.There are many memebers of the body and they all have their parts..but homosexuals and mormons . I do pray for all the Lord gives me to pray for.(Jeremiah 8:9
The wise men are ashamed, they are dismayed and taken: lo, they have rejected the word of the LORD; and what wisdom is in them? (John 12:48
He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
and whoever elese wants to stand up and say they believe in God, which one? There is only One Jesus and Only One True God, but many gods..idols in the world.If a man don’t serve Jesus Christ and is not a Christian and they won’t to tell me about? what we need to do as Christians..no I will not listen to him,he does not have the mind of Christ and if he don’t serve Jesus Christ, he won’t have His mind,mormons don’t even believe in Jesus, they think he was a prophet…that’s it,right there even in that they have rejected the Son as the SON…of God…in doing that they have rejected Father God.They don’t even have the same book to live by.The bible is not their book to live by.If they witness to someone its not so they will be saved to serve Jesus Christ.No I would not even go to a meeting like that.A mixture is a Mixture…is confusion..is not of God,thats what I have been taught by Father God.Compromise,mixture, Father God said come out from among them and be ye separate.2 Corinthians 6:17
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.I have nothing to say bad about anyone that was there,I would pray for the lost…including the mormons.
Glenn Beck is a bit of an enigma. While he searches American history for truths upon which this country was founded, he does not apply the same rigor to examining the Mormon position. As I pointed out in other posts, the archeological evidence for Mormonism is lacking and at times contradictory. Philosophically it is also flawed, they have a God that was once like a man and then became God. The problem with this of course is that if God evolved then he would need a cause. Anything that changes is a composite of potential and actuality and cannot account for its own being. So philosophically the Mormon position leads to an infinite regress of “gods” which is impossible.
All that being said, I have spent a great deal of time in Utah, and find the Mormons to be sincere, kind people with strong morals. It is unfortunate that they have been misled and are firmly entrenched by their social infrastructure. When one leaves the Mormon religion, one does not just change churches, one leaves a whole social network. Losing this social network makes it much more difficult for a Mormon to change worldviews, than say for a Catholic to become a Mormon or a protestant.
I must respectfully disagree with Mrs. Shold. Glenn Beck does speak certain truths, and not liking the source of truth does not make the truth any less worthy to hear. THIS CONFUSES TRUTH WITH ITS SOURCE. Most of Beck’s discussions are not religious but focus on the economy and where the country is going in terms of growing socialistic trends. He rightly points out the burden that the bailouts and healthcare reform will place on this country. He rightly points out some of the visions of the founding fathers and how far we are from those visions. I personally find the web of conspiracy involving multiple people he envisions to be doubtful. It seems more likely that these people share similar ideas because they have all been drinking from the same philosophical waters.
Last, I would wager to say that most Christians don’t realize that the Jesus of the Mormons is quite different from the Jesus they believe in. So when Beck talks about getting back to God, they interpret what he says within the context of their own understanding of God, not within the Mormon context. Beck does not spend time trying to sell the Mormon vision of God. So his general message of restoring honor and God as the ground for this country rings true. Beck’s vision of Who God is may not be true, but his vision that the country needs God is. While many are trying to put God and morality in the closet, Beck is performing a service by bucking the trend. And for that He deserves Kudos.
Glen beck can do good deeds but he can not bring forth good fruits from God because he is not of God.He rants,mocks and says mean and hateful things about people.He does not have the love of God.He has the love for himself[glen beck].He has an agenda and I believe that is to self promote glen beck.It sure is not the Lord, he does not have the Lord in him!His God does not exist!beck is full of hate,not love.
Glenn Beck is the establishment’s counterfeit talking head for the Patriot movement. He mixes every truth he speaks with falsehoods. He said that the Army should arrest Ron Paul supporters because of their “Revolution” signs, he said that he hates the 9/11 wives for questioning the govt. The mosque deal is establishment funded. The money for this Imam leads back to the CFR, the Rockefeller foundation is the top 3 of the top 4 funders for the Imam with the Carnegie foundation being the other. This is the Oligarchy stirring up nationalist sentiment against muslims in order to get the war wagon rolling toward Iran. I’m not an apologist for Iran, they have a corrupt govt. But, this is another example of blowback through our meddling foreign policy. We’ve let the CIA go off of the leash since the OSS disbanded and now we have to deal with what was created in our name. You dont fight a war against cells of people with a standing army, you use law enforcement and intelligence. If you use a standing army against such small groups its akin to swatting a fly with a bulldozer. We all know there is an oligarchy that does not act in our interests, (wall street, city of london, military industrial complex, Rockefeller & co, corporations) its time we put the light on them. If we want to continue the America we’ve always thought we’ve had its time to activate within the political system
Is Glenn Beck speaking strongly against homosexuality and it’s agenda? Is he speaking strongly against abortion and how it is a violation of this nation’s foundational values?
I’ve heard him talk about how these two issues divide the nation, but it seems to me that these two matters are of grave importance to the church and that a righteous stand concerning these two subjects should unite the church and the nation, with God’s blessing of course. (Psalm 127:1, Amos 3:3)
I also consider Daniel 2, the head of gold and the feet of both iron and clay.
The spirit of compromise is not the Lord’s cup.
I think of the time when Jehoshaphat joined affinity with Ahab. II Chron 18.
Also Ezra 9:14.
I did not hear that Glenn Beck asked certain people of faith to stand with him, but rather that they themselves would do what they can to bring this nation back to God. Still, we have to be careful.
So I hear that it’s been said by Glenn Beck, “What’s the big deal with gay marriage? How does that affect me?”
I think we can look to Lot and his family for those answers. Let’s think about how it affected them and why God put that record in the scriptures.
We might also learn something from the apostle Peter about this (II Peter 2:6-8) and if we can receive this much we might also learn some more from the apostle Paul by his letter to the Romans.
This nation will not come back to God simply by the issue being money and how the government spends it, or how it manages an economy by it’s powers of taxation or other laws made by it’s other agenda’s or philosophies of man, the underlying thing of it all being money.
This nation needs to hear strong leadership voices as concerning what’s right or wrong, but it needs to be more than about decisions that affect our standard of living, money, retirement, money, how we do business, money, the overstepping of government powers and how they affect the things that affect our money.
G-d can only use a donkey if and when the prophet is so blind that it cannot see an angel with a sword standing in front of him. So many preachers in this country are Balaam brothers so G-d probably decided to use a donkey. Notwithstanding, Glen Beck also has taken the error of Balaam and Balack called the sin of GREED and FAME… Shalom and happy New Year to all true believers around the world come September 8th at sundown.
Beck is a Mormon and is not qualified to speak on issues of faith. His Jesus is a different Jesus than the Jesus of the gospels. There is the chance that someone could be attracted to Mormonism as a result of his “evangelizing”. What then? A spiritual tragedy of eternal proportions occurs.
We need people like Glenn Beck, Hannity (Catholic), O’Reilly (Catholic) why? God has all of this in control. The false hope of America rising from the ashes is a detraction from the One True Hope of Jesus. When He comes back He will rectify everything. Nothing is getting past God.
As we study and look at Biblical history we find that God has used many unique and unusual voices to call His people back to Himself. We know that He has used non-believers, even heathens, and a donkey to call His people back. He used a man who had persicuted the church by the name of Saul, who was renamed by the Lord, Paul. Though we know he converted to Christ and became an Apostle by divine calling and revelation.
Knowing what I know about Mormonism I could never endorse the Mormon religion. However, I do believe that in the midst of this God could use this rally to call His Church back to Himself and our Biblical roots.
Maybe God is useing a mormon to tell the Church
to WAKE UP!
I can’t believe how unfair and mean some of you are with Glen Beck. His program is NOT theological but when he comes to history of our nation’s roots. He was great. It was non denominal and it was a plea to go back to the Constitution and Judeo-Christian values.
Why rean all that other nonsense into it.
If in the future Glen tries to tell us we need to read the book of Mormon then we should share Holy Scripture to share the true Messiah who is the only Savior. I love your approach to national rallies Dr. Brown. I love Glen for what he is, a news broadcaster not theologin. Let us love all people. True dialogue and networking on common values though we have distinctive values of are personal faith. Please do not sound like a bigot.
I can’t believe how unfair and mean some of you are with Glen Beck. His program is NOT theological but when he comes to history of our nation’s roots he is accurate and truthful. It was non denominal and it was a plea to go back to the Constitution and Judeo-Christian values.
Why read all that other nonsense into it.
If in the future Glen tries to tell us we need to read the book of Mormon then we should share Holy Scripture to share the true Messiah who is the only Savior. I love your approach to national rallies Dr. Brown. I love Glen for what he is, a news broadcaster not theologin. Let us love all people. True dialogue and networking on common values though we have distinctive values of are personal faith. Please do not sound like a bigot.
Pray for Glen’s salvation but do not demean the value of his work that is Patriotic in scope.
(Luk 19:40) And he answered and said, I tell you that, if these shall hold their peace, the stones will cry out.
The church is holding its peace and not speaking out so, the stones (Glenn B) are crying louder. Shane on us.
“We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.”
Benjamin Franklin at the signing of the Declaration of Independence
When I first started watching Glenn Beck & found out that he was a Mormon, I listen very carefully to weigh his words to see if he really “knows the Lord at Savior”. One day he addressed that very question & he said that there was a time in his life that he realized that he needed his sins forgiven by Jesus Christ & he said he did ask Jesus to forgive his sins & come into his heart. That took a lot of courage to say that on national TV. I am convinced that Glenn Beck is a born again believer. I feel that God has placed him in a special place to call America back to prayer & God for such a time as this. This could be the catalyst that starts a Revival in America that will be the greatest revival America has ever seen….. Who else has stood up for God & done anything like 8-28-10…..People are hungry for the TRUTH or 500,000 wouldn’t have taken the time to show up for the event on 8-28-10. That should be enough to convince anyone what the people REALLY want & need.
I am blown away with these responses. Judge them by their fruit. Even James Robinson said, “shame on us, for not listening to G-d, that he had to go to a Morman and an alcoholic to get his message across.” Are we not at such a crucial time in our nation to stop dividing with our differences but standing together on what we agree upon! Glenn has been bearing wonderful fruit in our nation and for returning us back to our roots as a nation. Is it so hard to think that G-d could be using a Morman to unite our country? Did he not use Cyrus (a heathen) to return the Jews to Israel? And for his “hate-filled” speech – do you actually listen to his show? He is funny, and yes, at times will make fun of people with sarcasm – give me a break! that is his personality – but I listen to his shows (radio and tv) and have never heard the “hate- speech” that the media accuses him of.
I believe he is a trumpet of G-d during this time in our nation. This is not a religious thing – this is returning us to our roots as a nation – Judeo-Christian. Judge him by his fruits and you will see a man filled with the spirit and who speaks the truth and is uncovering lies that are trying to be covered.
Isn’t it time we step out of our divided views and come together to save our country?
did any of you go to the rally?
Remember the Lord once spoke out of the mouth of a donkey, why can’t He speak out of the mouth of glenn Beck?
The Lord is waking up the nation and the Church.
He will speak out of the mouth of whomever or whatever will be bold enough to speak.
I see Christians standing up and speaking. We are now awake. That right there is a good reason to rejoice. Let’s let God get out of the boxes of our limited understanding and see what glories He can accomplish. Let the Love of God flow saints. Now is a good time to be awake.
How many religeous leaders were there? Who from Dr. Martin Luther King’s family spoke? It was not a political rally – some of you just don’t get it, do you? This event was mainly for the Special Operations Warrior Foundation, of which they raised $6 million for the kids of these KIA Special Ops soldiers to go to school. Get your heads out of your self-righteous rear-ends and get with the program! This was also about restoring Honor and Character to this country! You had better stop walking on water and do what really needs to be done in this country!
Signed: A Christian,Conservative,combat veteran
BTW, you better get with the program before it’s too late and you can’t have a church, except to face Mecca 5 times a day!
We are truly living in the last days. Jesus couldn’t be more divided. My only advice to all true believers is to stay focus on Jesus. Pray for one another that we don’t take the mark of the Beast. Let us pray for those who have one foot in the world and the other in Heaven. Let us continue to pray for the Jews who are looking on, that they realize in every religion even in theirs, there are true believers and faults believers. I pray God, the Father, will move them to seek Him with all their heart and He will lead them to Jesus. Have a blessed weekend.
I would be supportive of the statements that we are not to get involved with Glen Beck because being a devout Morman he is not unitied with true Christians. I used to listen to him and was somewhat influenced by him until I became more enlightened.
I get newsletters from a ministry called With One Accord. The head is a former Morman high priest who I believe has some accurate info to share.
Here are some quotes from him(William Schnoebelen). “Among their other strange teachings Mormans promote the idea that the US Constitution is a devinely inspired documentl, just like Scripture. LDS prophets prophesied that the USConstitution would hang by a thread asnd that the elders of Zion would save it and America. They believe it is their political and prophetic destiny to save America by setting up a Mormon dictatorship with their prophet at its head.”
This newsletter is not online BUT you can go to http://www.withoneaccord.org. Then click at top of page Free Resources. Then click second article down Mitt Romney and the Morman plan for America. It talks about these issues in more depth
I believe William Schnoebelen has accurate info and this is alarming to me. Read and judge for yourself
As I view this whole issue, it seems to be no more than a white washed tomb, because Glenn Beck’s idea of bringing unity on a day celebrating Dr. Martin Luther King’s, “I Have a Dream” speech was a bit of an oxymoron. If he truly wanted to help to bring America back to its roots, then he would have stood arm-in-arm with those minority leaders who continue to fight for equality and justice – in remembering the words and intent of that monumental speech which has been etched into the fabric of our American roots. Mr. Beck was insensitive to call his meeting on such an occasion, and showed no genuine patriotic interest at all.
I listened to Beck and thought very highly of it. Reason being we as christians can do the same yet we do not. I heard him on Tv this friday and he and his three guest talked of knowing Jesus the whole time. If we were doing what Beck is doing with a group of people, reaching out to the whole world instead of staying inside our walls we could do the same thing.I am a born again child of God. Love the Lord with all my heart,yet I believe as long as we stay in our own group and do not learn to see others as Christ sees them we will not win the world. I believe if it is of God He will bless it. If not then God will take care of it. I hope this is a wake up call for us to do something as big.
we find today that there is a mixture of truth and a lie, and most people that will fall away from the truth of God;s word, are those whom believe that a Rabbin, Priest, Pastor, New Ager, what ever form it may be. that unless you ask or get their understanding of what you have read in the word of God, and NOT youself in trusting the Holy Spirit to show you the truth in His Word. and then when a bad penny turns up most people cannot tell the diference? now God loves the person that is a mormon. But Mormons do NOT love the God of the Bible, and Jesus is just a name that is used to cover truth of the matter. And that ALL religions are not of God, because Christianity is a Kingdom and NOT a Religion. and to be a Christian according to the Word of God.
Jesus Christ is above ALL other names, to God the Father and NOT mans Traditions, and or Religion.
you must be born again. not to be part of a religion, or tradition. and as the word says, NOT all that say they are Jews/Christians/Gentiles, are so. and Mormanism is NOT one. and i know; all men need to be born again in the Spirit. Johny Cash sang a song ‘I got Jesus and that’s enough” (brother ernie, God Bless.
are you kidding?
You say:”he should have stood arm-in-arm with those minority leaders…YADA,YADA(Hebrew word!)”.
HE DID STAND ARM-IN-ARM WITH Martin Luther King’s NEICE…you can’t get any closer to MLK’s “DREAM” than that!
To everyone else..PRAY for Glenn’s eyes to be opened to truth.I told him personally that I was praying for him & he told ME,”Don’t stop”!
I am a MESSIANIC BELIEVER & I was honored to spend G-d’s Shabbat with these people, in DC. There were many Jews & believers there…the “fields are white…where are the laborers”?
isn’t it funny, all religions wave the flag of Jesus. And yet preach the word of deception, as in their Candel sticks, idols, self prophets, and church denomination, and really what does “NON denomination” really mean? does it mean; all in that comes in? sounds like cancer to me? good cell and bad cell make a medicen work? and the body healthy? ernie
Did any of you go to the rally?
It was wonderful!
If the Lord can use a donkey to speak truth to a wayward person,
Certainly He can use the mouth of a Glenn Beck to speak to a wayward nation and a sleeping church.
It’s important to see what God is doing and join Him, rather than holding to our traditions of how He is going to cause revival to happen.
could you please explain to me, why do you write the word GOD, this way, G-D? when you are a Messianic Believer, one that believes Jesus is the Messiah. for (G) represents God the Fathe, (O)represents Jesus the Son, and (D) represents the Holy Ghost. So why G-D leaving the Messiah out of the Godhead? yours in love of Jesus. ernie
I would also like to know why Trish wrote God the way that she did, but instead of trying to guess, i’ll simply wait for her response. Remember, Ernie, the Jews did not say God’s name out of reverence, so we should keep things like that in mind before criticizing our fellow believers in the God of the Bible. I just got done listening to the entire Line of Fire broadcast concerning the “Back to God” rally, and i suggest that anyone who plans to submit a comment about the subjects discussed on the Line of Fire listen to the entire broadcasts as well. Dr. Brown plainly stated that Glenn Beck did not even realize that Aug. 25 was the anniversary of Dr. Martin Luther King’s “I have a dream…” speech. The fact that he had Dr. Martin Luther King’s neice to speak at the rally anyway shows that Someone (namely God) who did remmeber that Aug. 25 was the anniversary of Dr. Martin Luther King’s speech has been influencing Glenn to call the nation to repent of the wordly way that it has been living and go back to His way. Please, pray for Glenn Beck, and keep on praying for him. If God is opening Glenn Beck’s eyes to His will, then we should be praying that God will continue to use the man who He has chosen to lead this nation out of the dark ways of the world and point them toward Himself. Just so that there is no mistake, i am a bible believing Christian. I worship God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. Have faith that God will draw Glenn Beck to Himself with the help of the Bible believing Christians that he has had the opportunity to share the company of.
Hi Susan & Ernie,
I didn’t take it as ‘criticism”,I took it in Love..:)
Susan you are right,it’s the way Jews reverence God’s name…it’s just habit.
The Hebrew letters,YHVH,are HIS “unspeakable” name but Yeshua(Jesus) also opened the way for us to call this same unspeakable name… Abba(daddy).
Don’t worry,I didn’t take the “O” out for the “SON”.I’ve never heard that before.
I pray for Glenn & love listening to him but I am also “on guard”.
Dr. Mike: Good conclusion. Keep the faith. (Got to admit…I was kinda hopin’ you would end the program the way that you did, whew!)
Have some of you ever heard of any other commentators ever talk about Jesus, getting down your knees and pray, God, and having a relationship with God. Not too many do, in fact, Glenn Beck is the only one that I know. There have been people who have come to my door with whom I have not agreed. Why do pick on the Mormons and other denominations? Some Mormons may believe different as some of us do, but who are we to judge? To me and in his words, he is not a preacher. Like his politics, you can agree to disagree. Abraham Lincoln once called the nation to prayer while in the Civil War. How many Presidents have done that in the past or even now? What would you think if you didn’t know of his being a Mormon? Would you think of him as a born-again Christian? We have to come together as one body, and Yeshua (Jesus) would want us to. I pray for Glenn Beck that the Lord tells him what to do. Who’s to say that He is not working through him?
I believe this rally is about getting as many Christians as possible to move to the Republican Party so they can have their landslide victory in November and take the “White” House back in 2012. I don’t see where the high-jacking of a political party would serve any of us in the body of Christ. We are in this world, but, “not of this world”, while the tea partiers and Glenn Beck’s show are just anti-Obama and anti-government because this administration wants to help the poor. When did it become “evil” to help lift up those in need, and why does Beck hate poor people? Most of what angers the Lord the most, if you read your Bibles, is the mis-treatment of the poor, the widow, the homeless and the stranger. And if you do a word search for anyone of those words, you will usually find them spoken of in the same sentence! It’s in the railings of the Prophets, it’s in the New Testament. It’s in the very words of our Savior! I never heard the Lord say, “The Rich of America are loosing their money, Now Will I Arise to Help Them!” Let’s realize exactly how “far away” these movements are from the basic’s. “Above all things, follow peace with all men.”
I agree with “Bob T” that “you shall know them by their fruit”, because Beck’s fruit, if anyone takes the time to watch his show would soon “see” and “hear”, is rotten to the core. The Spirit within me was so terribly vexed when I watched Beck several times that I had to immediately turn the channel! My spirit could not abide the man.
I’d also like to hear them explain, in detail, what they mean by “Taking America Back”, and what is their definition of “Honor”. For if we seek honor from men, rather than from God, it is not honor at all. America already belongs to the Lord, for He raises up nations and He knocks them down. I believe He raised us up in order for the Gospel to get out, although I won’t go into the history of the Protestant Movement, you may want to look it up, and, also, to get the “one” vote needed to allow the Jewish people a homeland, and to protect them from their enemies while they got a foothold once more in their land.
I think we are confusing the “body of Christ” with America as a whole. And in doing so, we are acting as if we are either all going to live or die according to the “collective” morals of the people living here. Salvation is an individual endeaver with a “body” of beleivers as the ultimate result. That body is Christ’s, not Americas.
It looks too much like a dupe to me. Glenn Beck is an “idol” sheperd, leading us sheep astray. Do we want to associate ourselves with a movement who has Beck as “their” new messiah?
And I agree with those who said it is “self-promoting” for Beck. And the Tea-Party.
“As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.”
Your Sister in Yeshua,
I don’t think that he is anti-Obama, per se, but anti-big government. He thinks that President Obama is for big government and power as well. As for the poor people, he remembers when he hit bottom because he was an alcoholic and needed help. He remembers what it is like not to have anything. This is where he says that he started to turn his life around and Jesus came into his life. He also wants us to return to our founding fathers, who, during their time, always talked about God. Just look at some of the monuments and other places that have scripture or other things talking about God. What I do like about him, is that he shows you where he gets his information, then tells you not to believe what he says, but tells you to read up on it for yourself, both the good side and the bad. Was it a bad thing? What could be bad if it brings people together? When he was talking about the black robe preachers, he said that there were 240 ministers, rabbis, and an imam on the dais. Now that is what I call gathering people together for one cause! The tea party wants us to get back to our roots, too. As far as his political view is concerned, not only is he small government, but also for lower taxes. He often speaks of President Coolidge, who helped bring our country out of the depression that it was in. Whether I agree with his politics or not, I have an open mind to what he is saying, then hear what others say as well. I watch him everyday or whenever possible, so that I can hear his viewpoint. There are other commentators that I listen to as well. I don’t agree that Mr. Beck is “self-promoting”. To some degree, perhaps, just to get people to watch his show and listen to what he says. Now begs the question, if there was the media during Isaiah’s, Daniel’s, and all of the other prophets, would they be called self-promoting because there were many people who didn’t want to or just didn’t believe what they said? Sometimes, when someone is saying the right thing, there will be a critic among the crowd talking against them. I’m sure Billy Graham had many people do that. I’m not saying that Glenn Beck is like Billy Graham, but for someone who loves the Lord as he does, he is not afraid to come out and tell people that we have to have a one on one relationship with the Lord, and that we should get on our knees and pray to Him. Can anyone of us do the same? What would happen if we did? Would others come against us if they found us praying for a person in public right then and there instead of waiting when we pray before we go to bed or get up in the morning? What would people say if someone heard you bring someone to Jesus who didn’t believe in Him? Would they come after us? There is a good chance, but we shouldn’t have to worry about things like that. God will help us discern what is right and wrong. If we have a question, then we can ask Him. Glenn Beck never says that he is God, but he certainly likes to talk about him a lot!
Glenn Beck is not anti-Obama or against the poor. He speaks about how the people around him can affect his choices that he makes for the government itself and the people. He remembers the poor, because he was an alcoholic, now recovered, and was poor when he first started turning his life to Him and started tithing. If Isaiah and all of the prophets had the media that we do now, would there be people that would be shown to be against those prophets? No doubt that they would. Many people including the Pharisees and the Sanhedrin came against Jesus. Who is the one(s) that are self-promoting? Is he the one or is the media doing it for him? How about the apostles? How many people spread the Good News to others because of what they did? Were they self-promoting, too? If you listen to his programming, you will see that he talks a lot of God, praying, (just recently tithing), and having a one on one relationship with God.
I was brought up by a minister in the Protestant family of Christian churches, spent many years in the Anglican tradition and the Charismatic movement, and am more recently in a small Evangelical church. I am not searching for Christ. I am very happily His and have been since I can remember.
Recently, I was approached by Mormon missionaries, and I have undertaken, for my own spiritual and intellectual growth, to read the Book of Mormon as objectively as I know how, which may not be that objectively considering my deep, more traditional Christian roots.
I have seen numerous very authoritative-sounding comments and strongly worded assertions on this stream about the God and Christ of the Mormons. I have to ask whether those who are making those comments have ever read the Book of Mormon. I’m reading it now, and I am not seeing in it much truth to the strong assertions I’ve seen made in prior comments here. I don’t advocate that we all read the Book of Mormon, but I must say that those who feel that they are so much of an authority on it probably should at least read it or refrain from making such bold comments so authoritatively.
I could here, but I won’t, cite numerous references from the Book of Mormon which pretty clearly, to me, refer to Jesus of Nazareth who was God’s son, crucified in roughly 30 AD in Jerusalem and raised from the dead after 3 days. Several passages say that it is in Him and these events that we must believe to be saved, and that this is the only way to be saved. Many of the things He is said to have done and said are reported in the Book of Mormon just as they are in the Gospels of the Bible. That person and those events are as central to the Book of Mormon as they are in the Holy Bible, from what I can tell.
I have to note that there are many expansions and “clarifications” in the Book of Mormon that would be very strange to most Christians, sort of like the Apocrypha is to non-Catholics, and I can understand why very strict more traditional Christians might not accept the Mormon faith as being Christian, but I’m not seeing much truth to most of the claims made above from my readings and discussions with their missionaries.
I read a recent comment on Glenn Beck trying to account for his extremely clear and flawless explanation of the Atonement on a recent show. The Christian author thought that maybe it came from his Catholic upbringing. It came right out of the Book of Mormon. The author asked someone close to Glenn what his faith is. That person said, without hesitation, “Christian.” The author thought that that meant that he’s not really Mormon.
Mormons consider themselves to be Christian. In fact, they consider themselves to be the only true Christians, so they fall into the same trap as most of the rest of us Christians who think we are the only Christians and nobody else is because they don’t believe exactly the way we do.
I remember passing through Utah one Sunday and looking for a church to attend. All the churches I could find seemed to be Mormon, so I stopped at a hotel and asked at the desk if anyone could tell me where I could find a Christian church, not a Mormon church. The clerk was as gracious as he could be to help me find a “Christian” church. When we had found one, he let me know in no uncertain terms that Mormons are Christians.
Bob J. 9/4/10–15:18 CDT
I find myself disturbed at the blatant insensitivity demonstrated by Mr. Beck, and those who would support such a rally on that particular day. It seems as though many in the body of Christ have lost its discernment to the signs of the times and cannot see the truth though the smoke screen. We need the spirit of the sons of Issachar who had an understanding of the times.
Moreover, doesn’t it disturb you, and stir the Spirit within you that this rally brought a crowd of 99.5 percent white people, and practically no minorities, because most honored the “I Have a Dream” march? Can you not see the clears lines of racial division in this nation? Let’s face it, many Americans have been quite disturbed at the idea of a community center/mosque proposing to being built near Ground Zero – and Federalist will acknowledge that even though it is in their constitutional right – it has been deemed a bit insensitive to do so on that particular site. Hence, why is it so difficult for you to recognize the insensitivity that Mr. Beck demonstrated on having his rally on that particular day. Such a divisive spirit will never bring unity to this nation, nor to the body of Christ, no matter what justification or plea of ignorance is given.
When i suggested that if Glenn Beck was serious about bringing the nation back to the roots of the forefathers, that he should have walked arm-in-arm with those commemorating Dr. King’s speech, you said ” YADA,YADA.” Why?
Why not stand with those who have wanted to see the freedoms expressed to “all men?” If he was so sincere in not gathering for any political reasons, and wanting to call this nation back to G-d, then why not stand with those who were wanting that very thing? Is that not the very thing that Dr. King challenged this country to do? I don’t believe that Glenn Beck, who is supposed to be a historian, was ignorant of the ongoing tradition of remembering the historic speech – especially in light of him inviting Dr. King’s niece. Furthermore, I question his sincerity on the grounds of his bigoted remarks against President Obama, in calling him a racist.
It was both you and Susan acknowledging Dr. King’s niece appearing at his rally, and you said ” you can’t get any closer to MLK’s “DREAM” than that!” You may not be aware, but it is a well known fact that Dr. Martian Luther King’s son, Martin Luther King III, spoke at the “I Have a Dream” rally, because he believed in what his father died for.
Bob J. We seem to be drifting here from Beck to the Book of Mormon. Unlike the Bible, the claims of that book have been disproven, as to archeology in the Americas, historiography in the Americas, and its very allusions. There is no linguistic evidence either substantiating its claims. What is of most concern Bob, is your claim with this cult that “it is another testimony of Jesus Christ.”
Read the Gospels, Acts, the letters and the Revelation. How many direct testimonies of Jesus Christ appear there, and testimonies as well of being sealed as regenerated by the Holy Spirit, as representation, by comparison, not the message of the Book of Morman? What does Paul say is “my Gospel,” and what is the message of the Mormon book?
Further, how many of the Apostles wrote their coharmonious testimonies as dictated from the other side of a curtain, from claimed, while unseen by anyone but J. Smith, gold tablets, dug up from supposed American East Coast ground, while not being able to publicly show these to anyone? How many claimed to have seen God appearing with Jesus–both as men? How many set up a thocracy where Jesus was not King thereafter?
The other pieces simply do not fit. Do not be deceived simply because there are a few mentions of the historical actions of Jesus found in Smith’s book. These too are mentioned in many religious texts which have little or nothing to do with the true testimony of Jesus Christ.
Read 2 Cor. 4:5, the Apostles then did the exact opposite with the truth of the Gospel, for, they did not then preach themselves, and their group and its solicitation, as does Mormonism, and as did its founder. Further, Smit claimed that none of the churches in his nineteenth century period were of Christ at all! From April 1830 forward we do not have then “another revelation of Jesus Christ” given to anyone through Smith. Nor is his JUly 12, 1843 claim of revelation to endulge in polygamy substantiated by what Jesus taught about marriage and its foundations in the Sermon on the Mount and elsewhere.
Since the death of Smith all his supposed written material books have claimed additional revelation by the supposed “church” he founded, altering even some of its foundational doctrines. The Book of Mormon is not a testimony but a tale, yarn, or whatever about two ancient civilizations supposedly located in the Americas.
The DNA evidence of claimed Jewish ancestry and claimed earlier civilization ancestry to the supposed Native American Indians being “Jews” is especially nonsupporting of the Book’s claims. So scientific research disproves Mormon claims, upholding these as Moronic, not as revelations related to the “fullness of time” which was prophecied as to when the Lord Jesus arrived in Jerusalem. It is one of many legion claims too of a Pan Israel in the Americas. One of its offshoots, founded by Smith’s wife claims too that the return of Jesus will be to Independence MO., not the Mt. of Olives, as asserted in early Acts and in the Book of Zech.
To legitamize the illegitament is the intention of Smith, who is found out by his true actions, as were about power, sex, and economics in his instance. The claimed translation into English of the “unknown language” of the unseen by anyone else than Smith, lost Golden Tablets, holds with another claimed book he supposedly translated from the “Egyptian,” as though that had anything to do with the Bible’s YHVH self-revealed God at all.
And the evidence is in on that one, where the manuscipt involved, and so “translated” proved to be an “Egyptian Book of the Dead,” with his own handwritten notes in the margin, as is evidenced as now discovered and documented. What he asserted as a translation, was, in fact total fabrication. The aid of a transcriber, not wearing the supernatural spectacles, known as urim and thummim in his representation, further the alike ludicrous claims composing the situation of the creation of the Book of Mormon.
There is other evidence as well that the supposed sacred book was a reworking of another person’s 19th century stolen novel. Why would this be? Why did Joseph Smith do what he did?
MOrmon doctinal errors:
–God the Father has a body
–Man’s destiny is to evolve into Godhood
–“As man is, God once was: as God is, man may
–the fall of man saved mankind
–a heavenly existence can include many wives,
as eternally spoused
–salvation by works in the religious construct
–they remain “the only true church,”
–and preach themselves, not Jesus Christ
–they allude to JC briefly to justify their
religious constructs and hierarchy
–there is continuous revelation from God, only
to their group and its leaders, not to others
–proxy baptisms for deceased ancestors justify
them before God and in heaven
–Unlike the book of Hebrews, Jesus is not the
chief Priest, Melchizedek is, and their is a
related new Temple in Slt. Lake City where
Mormon men conduct continued new Temple rituals
–one can marry more than one person in “clestial
marriage” which will bond after death through
eternity in the heavens
–in the 1960s their priesthood was denied
blacks, only by later revelation was it given
–Women are excluded from their priesthood
–various honors are extended to certain members
to join certain exclusive governmental groups,
usurping any NT notion of a priesthood of all
–it is a synthesis from many Biblical and
nonBiblical sources of supposed “truth”
–Smith’s own wife declared Smith’s polygamy
doctrine false and offensive to her
“It combines a frontier relativism, intense relisious experience, and [once] popular evolutionary philosophies with a respect for Jesus and [some] Christian ethics” I. Hexham.
It also combines and confuses the fear of man, some rituals of inclusion and exclusion, falsely represented translations and mistranslations, and other highly suspect constructs with claimed revelation truth.
I’d like to quote a pastor (Paul Cole) who recently quoted the apostle, Paul: “ONE BODY, and ONE SPIRIT, ONE LORD, ONE GOD and FATHER of [us] ALL, Who is above ALL, (Sovereign over ALL), pervading ALL and [living] in us ALL. (Ephesians 4:4,5,6) Let’s realize our Oneness with God, and Oneness with One another! Blessings!”
Turning back to God is in the ballpark. Why dampen it and split hairs at this point? Looking at how society has become so morally relativistic if it is moral at all, how hopeless so many young people are, how much fornication is rampant with all its consequences, how can we complain?
I think Beck and all the others on the platform are not so much talking about religious doctrines as about values which are, of course, based upon our common JudeoChristian heritage. Those values are something we can all agree on, even if we can be endless ‘gnat strainers’ when it comes to the finer points of theology.
First I want to clarify the “Yada Yada”.You said “shalom”,I thought you were Jewish. I qualified it as a Hebrew word,I wasn’t using it lightly like SEINFELD does.I didn’t want to write out your whole quote.
Hebrew lesson:It means “know” like “to be made known”,or “you know”.I’m sorry,it DID sound like I was making fun…:(
YES,it really disturbs me that Blacks like “REVEREND” Sharpton didn’t participate & segregate THEMSELVES.I got asked that question at a Tea Party by an obvious “infiltrator” & I said,It’s a shame that they choose not to participate.AND..remember they are a MINORITY in the population,thus the name “minority”,so they are proportionately represented in a rally of all conservatives.It’s really not rocket science(I actually DO know rocket scientists so I can say that..;)
I was AT the rally,there WERE “black” people(I hate to use that word because THEY’RE NOT BLACK & I’M NOT WHITE..we are all different shades of ONE color.I have had “black” friends that I am DARKER than!).My daughter-in-law is black.
I watched the whole event on c-span,because I couldn’t really see or hear there,& there were black Americans!Look at some of the snapshots on some of the sites..there are blacks there.
Unknowing to me,one of my friends was behind Glenn in the Black Robe Regiment.He’s at the end,just over Glenn’s left shoulder,in a black hat.He’s a founder of the NAACPC,national Association of Conservative People of All Colors,of which I am a member.
“THE DREAM” belongs to ALL Americans…”that we would NOT judge people by the color of their skin but the content of their character”.I disagree with the Pres. because of “the content of his CHARACTER”..he’s JUST AS MUCH WHITE AS HE IS BLACK..I say more white because he was brought up in a white community by white grandparents.
A family friend of Al Sharpton’s was helping us buy our tickets in the subway.She was excited to see her family because they were being BUSSED DOWN from Sharptons church in NY for HIS rally.
“Content of his Character”
Jabez H. gave guite a lengthy list of the falsehoods in the Mormon Doctrine, while leaving out some of the more disturbing aspects of it. What bothers me is that the angel, Gabriel, supposedly gave Smith his revelations and pointed him to the tablets. To think that Gabriel also gave Muhammad his revelations, it brings to my mind the warning given to us, that if anyone preaches any other Gospel (doctrine) that what the Apostles delivered to us, that it is false. The Apostles and Paul, especially, warned us very strongly to flee from them, as “Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.” Hence, we have two very egregious and false doctrines
“disguised” as truth. We are not to fear them, but, neither are we to accept their doctrine. How much of our core beliefs are we willing to compromise on? And should we compromise at all?
The book of Mormon does not give glory to God, but, glorifies man. Furthermore, there is no mention of the work of the Holy Spirit in any of their writings. Nothing concerning being born of the Spirit. It is a worldly doctrine given by a man who was either, giving himself license to commit adultery, or, worse, he was a victim of Satan disguised as an angel of light.
Back to the Beck Rally. I don’t think he fully understands what Dr. King was forcing by his peaceful demonstrations and civil diobedience; with his greatest “I Have a Dream” speech. Dr. King was quietly and civilly “forcing” Government Intervention, by way of provoking the conscience of good Christians to stand with him for social justice. It took nothing less than new laws and an Ammendment to our Constitution in order to provide the African American with the same rights that others did not have to strive for. As our beloved Constitution states, these rights were supposed to be “God Given”, so, the beatings and the linchings and the gross prejudice that the, then Christian majority dealt to those once enslaved Americans, who were given their freedom after the Civil War (somewhat ironic to call it that) did not truly take effect until Dr. King “forced” the Federal Government to intervene.
The rally, itself, was probably good for those who attended out of a sincere heart to find solidarity with other people of faith. It was just the wrong day to host it. I didn’t hear Beck speak anything about the moral degredation that sparked the Civil Rights movement. Shouldn’t we have asked God to forgive us our sin of oppression of the African Americans who we once considered second class citizens? Especially on that day in particular? Aren’t we the children of those who ground the faces of God’s people in the dirt? God forgive America our sin of oppression. In Jesus Name. Amen.
I agree, Sheila, that America should acknowledge before God its sins and ask for forgiveness. I don’t think there can really be that national healing without that.
I appreciate your response, however, you seem to miss the point of what I was addressing. I found it quite interesting in your twist of thinking that those individuals who have recognized the importance of the “I Have a Dream” speech, for over a decade, should somehow have cancelled that event and follow the Mormon leader in his rally. That is completely unrealistic and is not worthy of consideration. What could bring this nation together is for all people: Black, White, Jew, Gentile, Protestant and Catholic, who would one day stand arm-in-arm as a nation of people progressing the effort to let freedom ring.
Hence, my appeal has been to the insensitivity towards Mr. Beck in so choosing to have his rally on that particular day, something you have failed to acknowledge. Just curious, I ask you, what is your opinion of the proposed mosque being built near Ground Zero? If you disagree with it, then please explain why? I only ask, because I find a correlation with this divisive rally being held on a day that Dr. King made such a monumental speech that any “Tea Party” member or conservative should support and embrace.
Thanks for your wonderful guidance on Mormonism. I can see that you are well versed in its teachings, and I find your comments very useful in my endeavors to understand what it’s all about.
I think that my point was that the Book of Mormon is, as I understand it, the chief authority from which Mormon beliefs arise. Hence, if it says it, that’s likely to be what they believe, and I find in it things that seem to me to contradict the sweeping statements so many people in this thread were saying. In fact, another comment was just posted, I see, that makes another such statement regarding the Holy Spirit. References to The Holy Spirit and His work in us are quite prevalent in the Book of Mormon–hard to miss for anyone who has bothered to look. In addition, I am told by the missionaries talking with me that the Holy Bible is considered to be God’s Word, too. Also, I”m told that they do not consider Jesus to be just another prophet but rather God incarnate, the Son of the Trinity in traditional Christian theology.
Please don’t misunderstand me to be saying that there aren’t many things about Mormonism, as you have so ably listed, that would give most non-Mormon Christians ample reason to question their Christianity. The simple fact that they have their own Scripture added to the Bible is certainly cause for reasonable suspicion and alarm, and I make no comment regarding its authenticity, only that, if it is the basis of their faith, then the broad claims I’ve seen against them from people commenting in this thread seem quite questionable to me.
One last point regarding the question about the relevance of the Book of Mormon to this discussion. It seems to me that this is really all about whether it makes any sense to hold such a rally with Mormons considering how at odds their beliefs are with respect to those of other Christians. The beliefs of the Mormons relative to other Christians were therefore forcefully stated but seemed without reasonable basis. Maybe the truth doesn’t matter, just our perceptions. In that case, perhaps the Book of Mormon is irrelevant, otherwise, maybe it isn’t. That said, the list you gave would be plenty to convince most that Mormons are not Christian regardless of the points I mentioned where they may agree with most other Christians. I am not really in a position yet to validate your list fully, but I am seeing hints of it in what the missionaries have given to me, so I suspect that it is pretty solid, and, once again, I appreciate the considerable effort you may have made to provide it and your discussion to us. They are helpful to me, and I think a good addition to help put the discussion on much more factual ground. Bob J. 9/4/10, 23:52 CDT
Yes, Gabriel was claimed as one source for J. Smith and revelation, as well as Muhammed. Muhammed’s Gabriel shoved him against the wall of a cave and insisted that he recite what was told him, to the point of not breating. Later this became the insistent phrase of confession for the Moslem (with significant roots in its rituals and adherence in ploytheism, as well as a history of betraying its own agreements with other people groups, and beheading its declared enemies).
In fact, Smith altered his first printed account of how he knew what he knew at least three times. Gabriel truly spoke to Mary, Mother of the Messiah, so, if you want to be thought of as a person carrying a new special “revelation”, why not Gabriel?
typos plague me, I request prayers.
Bob J., Did the “missionaries” put the graphical chart before you, and ask their question; if Jesus is the Son of God, then what would the name of His church be? So straightforward, and logical, right? Been to a cookie cutter meeting yet? I have a closet full of dress shirts which I do not use much, if you need one.
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