Can You Be Gay and Christian?

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Dr. Brown discusses the major issues in the current debate, reviewing the contents of his new book, addressing the major “gay Christian” arguments, and talking about keys to effective evangelism. Those who have struggled with same-sex attractions are especially encouraged to call. Listen live here 2-4 pm EST, and call into the show at (866) 348 7884 with your questions and comments.

 

Hour 1:

Dr. Brown’s Bottom Line: Jesus did tell us that it was not just hearing the Truth, but continuing in the Truth, continuing in His Word that would make us real disciples; and then, and only then, will we experience real freedom.

 

Hour 2:

Dr. Brown’s Bottom Line: Don’t let your desires, your attractions define you; be defined by the quality of your relationship with God!

 

SPECIAL OFFER! THIS WEEK ONLY! 
This week, we’re offering two important resources from Dr. Brown, his brand new book, Can You Be Gay and Christian?, and his DVD debate with gay activist (and professing born-again Christian) Harry Knox. You can get both of these key resources for the super low price of just $25! Postage Paid! That’s a $15 savings!
Order Online!

Other Resources:

Is There Such a Thing as Ex-Gay? An Interview with Anne Paulk

Questions Concerning the Possibility of an Openly Gay NFL Player, and Dr. Brown Takes Your Questions

Dr. Brown Debates Homosexuality with Prof. John Corvino and Then Discusses Mean-Spirited Communication in the Body (and More)

24 Comments
  1. “Can You Be Gay and Christian?” is incredibly deceptive, cavalier and cruel, dismissively deriding gay suicides, transgender issues and marriage equality. As I read the book I realized Brown cannot allow himself to consider that he could be wrong on this issue. He presumes to be 100% certain of God’s views as though his interpretations were the only ones. And his cult-like followers cut and paste his instructions to attack anyone who disagrees. They send hundreds of ad hominem attacks to anyone who disagrees and then send amazon hundreds of emails demanding the offender be silenced in the public square as their “Savior and Lord. Michael Brown” demands (that is from
    Brown seems oblivious to the fact that every civil rights advance since the abolition of slavery has been opposed using bible verses. Slave owners had a stronger biblical case than Brown offers here.
    He is a master of insinuation and misdirection. In Brown’s book, gays turn heterosexual all the time (though in real life I challenged him a few years ago to find me one of these people, but one who would not lose out financially if he admitted still being gay, and of course, Brown could not produce such a person. He did send me a nice guy who had been homeless for years and was now working for a ministry and living a sexless marriage with a woman) Brown unwittingly undermines his own case by using the story of Christopher Yuan, a man who claims to have gone from major drug dealing criminal and addict to a Christian in a jail-house conversion. And Brown assumes the man with the long sociopathic past must be telling the truth now (minus any proof beyond the man’s claims), but even if Yuan is living celibate in spite of my doubts, the drug dealer undercuts Brown’s cavalier assumptions that any true Christian can become heterosexual with just a little faith. Yuan has said in his book and speeches that he never chose to be same-sex attracted(gay) and that his sexual orientation is still gay. Yuan says over and over nobody chooses to be gay. The ex-dealer says he now lives a celibate life and that has helped him get a great paying job at a major Christian organization. If Yuan were to admit to not being asexual, he would lose his job and book and speaking deals and Christian TV appearances. By claiming to be asexual in his life Yuan profits handsomely, but this still shows that even this man with the dramatic tale of conversion did not become heterosexual. Brown’s claims all lack any authenticity. He finds one doctor in the nation who is against transgender surgeries in some cases, and Brown deduces this means we can dismiss the issue as nothing but some gay drama. Brown has written derisive anti-gay books and articles before. His “Queer Thing” book shows a gay man as someone who does not wear pants, just pink fluffy slippers. And that is the book he claims is his serious academic work.
    I plan to save my copy of Brown’s book so I can show it to my grandkids and explain to them this is exactly how my grandparents’ generation wrote about interracial marriage. The problem with prejudice is that one can’t see it until it is pointed out enough by others. I was raised with the same unseen assumptions in bible classes, too, but I have learned and grown. I hope Brown does someday, too. His education is in languages, not medical science or human sexuality. When one of his grandkids or relatives comes out of the closet, I hope Brown will finally come to understand.

  2. Bo,

    I avoid the “how many angels can stand on the head of a pin” style of exegetical bickering.

    I think it is very poor hermeneutics to parse sch details from a story that was never meant to be read that way.

    I don’t think the authors of the bible ever meant it to be a pregnancy manual.

    I respect your right to not have an abortion based on what you infer from the bible.

    Similarly, I respect a woman’s right to infer differently and make her own health decisions. I certainly don’t support enforcing your biblical hermeneutics with the power of government.

  3. Dr. Brown,

    Greg is really good at avoiding direct questions regarding scripture as you can see above. I only posted a link to the actual questions, knowing that he would try to evade and hide from real answers. He proved me right. Would you mind asking him to actually answer the questions on the correct thread?

    Shalom

  4. Bo,

    Here is why you and I will probably never agree on this subject, even though I believe you love the bible as much as I do.

    We read the bible very differently.

    I suspect that you read it like many conservative Christians do: you start with a moral presumption “abortion is wrong” and then you search for verses which back you up.

    I, in contrast, I open my bible and ask, “What is the point of this passage?”

    In the verses you cited previously, I think the point is to establish Jesus’ divinely anointed status.

    I most certainly don’t think the passage is meant to instruct about the morality of abortion.

    If you want to infer other things from this passage — I respect that. But I don’t believe your personal inferences have the authority of scripture.

  5. “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, so that heterosexuals who believe in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”

    John 3:16 (Revised Conservative Version)

  6. Someone can have lustful desires and be a true believer in Y’shua…even if they call him by a fictitious name. Someone can even be a true believer if they fall into the sin of homosexuality. But someone that actively participates in grave sins such as homosexuality is in great danger of loosing their inheritance in the kingdom of heaven. The deceitfulness of sin will rob us of our salvation if we continue in a lifestyle of sin. Homosexual lifestyle is an openly unrepentant sinful lifestyle and will ultimately result in the loss of salvation if continued in. Homosexual marriage is the commitment to continue in an openly unrepentant sinful lifestyle.

    Heb 3:13 but exhort one another day by day, so long as it is called To-day; lest any one of you be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin:
    14 for we are become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence firm unto the end:
    15 while it is said, To-day if ye shall hear his voice, Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
    16 For who, when they heard, did provoke? nay, did not all they that came out of Egypt by Moses?
    17 And with whom was he displeased forty years? was it not with them that sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness?
    18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that were disobedient?

    1Co 6:9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,
    1Co 6:10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

    1 Jo 3:4 ¶ every one that practises sin practises also lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.
    5 and ye know that *he* has been manifested that he might take away our sins; and in him sin is not.
    6 whoever abides in him, does not sin: whoever sins, has not seen him or known him.
    7 children, let no man lead you astray; he that practises righteousness is righteous, even as *he* is righteous.
    8 he that practises sin is of the devil; for from the beginning the devil sins. to this end the son of god has been manifested, that he might undo the works of the devil.
    9 whoever has been begotten of god does not practise sin, because his seed abides in him, and he cannot sin, because he has been begotten of god.

    1 Jo 2:3c And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
    5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

    Le 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

    Ro 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
    25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
    26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
    27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
    28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
    29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
    30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
    31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
    32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

    So those that justify those that do such things deserve the same judgment from YHWH as those that do them. So I have to ask can someone that supports homosexuality be a true believer…do they lose their inheritance in the kingdom also?

    Shalom

  7. Greg,

    Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

  8. Has anyone seen or heard of a devil repenting and asking Jesus to save them from all their sins?

    Practicing homosexuality is sin.

  9. I do believe someone can be gay and Christian, but actively seeking and desiring to repent. There is a world of difference between someone who is gay with no desire to be healed and cleansed (essentially finding nothing wrong with it and lacking conviction) and someone who identifies as being gay and struggles with it. They are convicted and actively seek God to be freed. One will overcome but the other will eventually have to decide between self and God. I have dealt with my own form of struggles pertaining to other immorality for ages and usually denied conviction often living with infrequent shame and guilt. Then the hands of God came upon me in an amazing way and conviction set in and I have ex

  10. I’m not sure how one becomes arrogant enough to tell others who is a Christian and who is not. There are no real rules in this religion. It’s all make believe so people can make believe whatever they want and call themselves a Christian. Christianity would just be another death cult if it had fewer adherents.

  11. VaIn,

    Rhetoric and insults, but no substance again. Your religion is the one that has slaughtered the most people. Who belongs to the death cult? I think that it is you who are so filled with hatred toward those that are not of your religion. Are you ever going to step up to the plate and answer Sheila?

    You wrote:
    ““…but there’s a clip with Ravi Zacarias in it where he expounds on the reality of moral absolutes…”

    Oh, I absolutely LOVE knocking down this stupid argument. Name something that is always wrong.”

    Sheila responded:
    “Let’s just start with rape, Van. It’s always wrong!”

    And you VaIn, did not show her how rape is not always wrong. You loose once again.

  12. VaIn,

    You wrote:
    “I’m not sure how one becomes arrogant enough to tell others who is a Christian and who is not.”

    Who is the arrogant one that is talking down to us? Did you know that your post above is quite arrogant?

    You wrote:
    “I know a lot more about the Bible than any believer does.”-http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2014/02/11/questions-concerning-the-possibility-of-an-openly-gay-nfl-player-and-dr-brown-takes-your-questions/#comment-672685

  13. The religion of some men seems to be pride, condemnation, false accusation, and all kinds of things of the flesh and devil. They go out to make disciples by doing those things, hoping others will follow along.

  14. Van, how about honoring God in some posts, even if you don’t believe in him? I should think every man could honestly say that there is so much good in the world that it’s certainly possible that someone, some honest and just creator might be behind all the good we see around us, and if in fact there is a devil, then it could be him who is behind the scenes working every evil.

    The creation certainly appears as if it has a divine order, therefore men believe there is a divine intelligence behind all that is around them that was created.

  15. Can you be gay and Christian? Well, can you be adulterous and Christian? Can you be murderous and Christian? Can you be covetous and Christian? I mean, is sin sinful? Once again, the “gay Christian” argument always falls back on this principle: “My sin is just too wonderful, it gives me too much pleasure, so I can’t give it up. Instead, let me try to find a way to reconcile it with the Bible.” This is an absurd rationale. Moreover, I don’t for a minute believe that these people who actively promote “gay Christianity” are sincere. I’m sorry, but I honestly don’t believe them.

  16. The Rougher Way

    So many times I’ve heard it said,
    “The way to hell is smoothly paved
    with the high and good intentions
    of those that think they’re surely saved.”

    But those that turn around and climb
    the rocky path to heavens gates,
    though they stumble often times,
    for their good deeds, reward awaits.

    It’s NOT the heart or thought that counts,
    though pure and noble they may be,
    if the hands and feet attached
    are pointed toward the flaming sea.

    The only kind of faith that’s true
    is clearly seen by all around.
    It’s not belief or what we say
    but what we DO on earthly ground.

    The Creator of our world has said
    He fights against the ones that think
    that they can go their asphalt way
    proudly blinded to how low they sink.

    But grace and strength await the soul
    that can bring himself to say
    “I was wrong…I’ll do Your will.”
    And continue up the rougher way.

  17. Ray said, “Van, how about honoring God in some posts, even if you don’t believe in him?”

    > How about honoring Allah, the God of Islam, even though you don’t believe in him? How about it Ray, why don’t you do that? When you figure that out perhaps you’ll understand how ridiculous your request is.

  18. I am guessing that VaIn does not go on Hindu and Muslim websites and be so disrespectful. Maybe he does, since he thinks that he is God. But he does not have the guts to answer even the simplest of questions…but he sure boasts that he can.

    Vain wrote:
    “I’m right here and I will continue to destroy every argument that comes my way. So bring ‘em on if you dare.”

    VaIn wrote:
    “I’m not sure how one becomes arrogant enough to tell others who is a Christian and who is not.”

    Bo wrote:
    “VaIn still does not answer the challenge to prove himself to be honest. He brings no facts to the table, just insult and rhetoric to back his bigoted religion of naturalism and atheism (He actually worships himself, though). I offer the following as proof:

    VaIn wrote:
    ” There are millions of American Christian men cheating on their wives with other men.”

    Bo Wrote:
    “This is nothing more than Rhetoric and insults and childishness. Please back this up with some facts.”

    Thus far VaIn has not responded.

    VaIn wrote:
    ““…but there’s a clip with Ravi Zacarias in it where he expounds on the reality of moral absolutes…”
    Oh, I absolutely LOVE knocking down this stupid argument. Name something that is always wrong.”

    Sheila responded:
    “Let’s just start with rape, Van. It’s always wrong!”

    And VaIn did not answer her as to how rape is not always wrong. He couldn’t.

    Bo wrote:
    “When are you going to stop dodging and man up and answer the charge that you lied and misrepresented Schweitzer? In case you and others have almost forgotten, here is a gentle reminder of the challenge:

    Why should anyone listen to you when you have been proven wrong and won’t admit it? Why should we listen to a troll?

    troll
    One who posts a deliberately provocative message…with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument.”- http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=troll
    When are you going to answer the charge that you took Scweitzer out of context? Did you do it intentionally or were you duped by someone and then just regurgitate the lie? At least admit that you were wrong, even if you won’t tell us your motive. Don’t dodge or ignore this if you are an honest man. To refresh you memory, here is the challenge:

    Below is one of many examples of Van’s deception technique. He has been asked repeatedly to either admit that he has posted false testimony or to produce verification of his assertion. After being called on the carpet, he conveniently ignores all rebuttals and continues to regurgitate deception mixed with a huge amount of rhetoric, vitriol and insult. He is not to be taken seriously as scholar or a commentator. He is a troll, and nothing more.

    Van wrote:
    “’There is nothing more negative than the result of the critical study of the life of Jesus. The Jesus of Nazareth who came forward publicly as the Messiah, who preached the Kingdom of God, who founded the Kingdom of Heaven upon earth, and died to give his work its final consecration, never had any existence.’ – Albert Scweitzer (1875-1965)

    You just accused Albert Schweitzer of being classless, unqualified, and simple minded. Par for the course for people who have no respect for intelligence and education.

    Many scholars have tried to find evidence from outside the Bible that Jesus really existed. They came up with nothing, absolutely nothing as Dr. Schweitzer said.

    You people have bought into all the lies of religion and then you repeat these lies without any hint of a conscience. Calling me a liar when all I do is speak the truth just shows how backward your evil religion really is.”

    Sheila responded:
    “Well, it’s a classic move by you to rip a quotation out of context. Who is it you’re listening to? It makes no sense for you to drop what you think is a bombshell when all you’ve done now is make yourself look more foolish because you never considered that Google just might have Schweitzer’s book on line.

    Anyone who cares to can read further down the chapter and see that Schweitzer was referring to the historic Jesus as He was portrayed by the modern theological historians of his own time. His thought was that “That” Jesus never existed… His point was that we end up molding Him according to our modern way of thinking categorically. We essentially risk minimizing the astonishing profundity of His teachings.

    This link begins with the quote you gave us and then explains exactly what Schweitzer was getting at. The man made the cross he wanted on his own grave, for Pete’s sake.
    http://books.google.com/books?id=uzRXxvPsylkC&pg=PA478#v=onepage&q&f=false

    Bo wrote:
    “To date, Van still ignores the proof of his irrelevancy. He continues to persecute in the only way he as power to do. That power, in this instance, being the grace of Dr. Brown. Be sure to thank YHWH that Van is not in any governmental position where his bigotry and prejudice can do more harm.”

    2 Timothy 3
    12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
    13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
    14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
    15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
    16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
    17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

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