This topic is one that I have wrestled with for a very long time. It’s interesting that this came up after Dr. Brown just returned from India where Christians are willing to die for their faith. The ones who threathend to turn their music up so loud that they would disrupt the services may have been some of the same ones who had killed members of that group. I guess what I’m saying is, if the widows and family members “knew” who it was that killed their loved ones, would they be justified in “taking them out” so that no more Christians would lose their lives? “Who ever seeks to save their lives, shall lose it; and whoever shall lose their lives for me shall save it.” Not that the Jews lost their lives for the Gospel, they lost their lives only because they were Jews. While those in India lost their lives only because they were Christians. The mindset of a believer in Jesus is different than that of others who don’t know Him.
Do we place less value on the death of a few, as opposed to the death of millions? We focus on the 6 million Jews who lost their lives, but, there were over 4 million others who lost their lives. Some were Christians, some were mentally ill patients, mongolian children, those with down syndrome, geriatric children, the extremely frail and sickly, homosexuals and all others that they classified as undesirables. That’s 4 million more “forgettable” people, which we have–forgotten. The cancer of superiority had spread to other countries as other prominent leaders also sold out those they deemed undesirable as well. We focus on the Jews, because they were a single race of people designated for slaughter by the ruler of a nation who had somehow managed to seduce an entire population of people into believing he had the solution to all their problems which they were convinced were caused by the Jews. They became the “scapegoat” placed on the altar of the Fuher who was able to hypnotize an entire nation with nothing more than powerfully spoken words! What’s wrong with this picture? Can we not hear the falsehoods spoken from the mouths of some powerful orators preaching from their own pulpits today? I don’t mean political pulpits. I mean the Christian pulpits. Some use the exact same skills of oration that Hitler used. They’ve been well coached in the same oratorial manner, with their delivery rising into a feavored pitch, until finally they have whipped their audience into a frenzy. I see the sheeple reaching out their hands toward to the pulpit and crying out in unison their amens and halleluiahs and I think I’m looking at Hitler preaching to lost sheep who are hanging on his every word. And in the background we can see the American flag proudly displayed behind them. What, exactly are they preaching? This is what I hear. That you are a good Christian only if you are a good American. And being a good American means being a Christian who walks and talks and thinks and votes like them. Well, “I don’t care what you do–I wouldn’t want to be like you.” I’ve deliberately drawn the parellel between tying Christianity with patriotism, because that’s exactly what happened in Germany. Not that all fell for it, as Eric pointed out, but, only that the equation was drawn and religion was thoroughly mixed with the political climate of the day.
Can history repeat itself? Oh yes, it can.
I’ve not actually answered the main question as to whether or not someone would have been justified in trying to assassinate Hitler because I’ve not decided yet. I’d like to hear some others opinions who might sway mine one way or the other. Because as a Christian I can’t help but think that if we are the last person to murder someone, then we become a murderer as well. This idea of, “You shall not murder”, has been reasoned by Rabbis and theologians for ages and ages, and they came up with the idea that God meant, “You shall not commit ‘premeditated’ murder.” So, the catch 22 is that Hitler commited premeditated murder, so, it is alright to do the same. I really don’t know, but, I would like to be able to work this out from my Christian philosophy and what I learned from the Lord. I welcome all the various takes on this and am open to others views. There were so many assassination atempts on Hitler’s life that it seemed he was supernaturally invincible and it can only be explained in that nothing happens outside of God’s will, ultimately. So, while it seems Satan had his day through Hitler, does not the Lord have eyes that He can see, and ears that He can hear, and, as the Jews ask, “Where was God during the holocaust?” Is that the bigger question? God answers both questions, in my mind. “In all their afflictions, I was afflicted.” “And whatever you do to the least of these, my brothers, you do to me.” And “that hell below, was moved to greet Hitler at his coming” brings some solace, but, it does not replace those who lost their lives. What if, God, willing to show His great power and glory, will raise up those dried bones, as in Ezekiel, and put flesh on them once more and breath the spirit of life back into them, and by doing so, put Hitler and Satan to shame and shut their mouths and torment them forever as they tormented others, would that be enough? It would for me. Although, I don’t want to even have to watch that. I pray the Lord dumps them in the lake of fire, and that I have no memory of them at all. And I’m reminded of another idea, in that the Jews would not have suffered what they did, “except the Lord had sold them” to their enemy. Do we know the mind of God? I certainly don’t. Neither do I know His purposes from beginning to end, but, I do trust Him, and if He caused Michael to retreat, there was a reason for it.
I’ve more thoughts on this, but, I just wanted to open up a discussion. I’d like to hear some others views about it.
I may have gotten mixed up and placed my comment under the wrong heading. I won’t know until I listen to both again. So, if you need to, you can put it under the proper heading.
This topic is one that I have wrestled with for a very long time. It’s interesting that this came up after Dr. Brown just returned from India where Christians are willing to die for their faith. The ones who threathend to turn their music up so loud that they would disrupt the services may have been some of the same ones who had killed members of that group. I guess what I’m saying is, if the widows and family members “knew” who it was that killed their loved ones, would they be justified in “taking them out” so that no more Christians would lose their lives? “Who ever seeks to save their lives, shall lose it; and whoever shall lose their lives for me shall save it.” Not that the Jews lost their lives for the Gospel, they lost their lives only because they were Jews. While those in India lost their lives only because they were Christians. The mindset of a believer in Jesus is different than that of others who don’t know Him.
Do we place less value on the death of a few, as opposed to the death of millions? We focus on the 6 million Jews who lost their lives, but, there were over 4 million others who lost their lives. Some were Christians, some were mentally ill patients, mongolian children, those with down syndrome, geriatric children, the extremely frail and sickly, homosexuals and all others that they classified as undesirables. That’s 4 million more “forgettable” people, which we have–forgotten. The cancer of superiority had spread to other countries as other prominent leaders also sold out those they deemed undesirable as well. We focus on the Jews, because they were a single race of people designated for slaughter by the ruler of a nation who had somehow managed to seduce an entire population of people into believing he had the solution to all their problems which they were convinced were caused by the Jews. They became the “scapegoat” placed on the altar of the Fuher who was able to hypnotize an entire nation with nothing more than powerfully spoken words! What’s wrong with this picture? Can we not hear the falsehoods spoken from the mouths of some powerful orators preaching from their own pulpits today? I don’t mean political pulpits. I mean the Christian pulpits. Some use the exact same skills of oration that Hitler used. They’ve been well coached in the same oratorial manner, with their delivery rising into a feavored pitch, until finally they have whipped their audience into a frenzy. I see the sheeple reaching out their hands toward to the pulpit and crying out in unison their amens and halleluiahs and I think I’m looking at Hitler preaching to lost sheep who are hanging on his every word. And in the background we can see the American flag proudly displayed behind them. What, exactly are they preaching? This is what I hear. That you are a good Christian only if you are a good American. And being a good American means being a Christian who walks and talks and thinks and votes like them. Well, “I don’t care what you do–I wouldn’t want to be like you.” I’ve deliberately drawn the parellel between tying Christianity with patriotism, because that’s exactly what happened in Germany. Not that all fell for it, as Eric pointed out, but, only that the equation was drawn and religion was thoroughly mixed with the political climate of the day.
Can history repeat itself? Oh yes, it can.
I’ve not actually answered the main question as to whether or not someone would have been justified in trying to assassinate Hitler because I’ve not decided yet. I’d like to hear some others opinions who might sway mine one way or the other. Because as a Christian I can’t help but think that if we are the last person to murder someone, then we become a murderer as well. This idea of, “You shall not murder”, has been reasoned by Rabbis and theologians for ages and ages, and they came up with the idea that God meant, “You shall not commit ‘premeditated’ murder.” So, the catch 22 is that Hitler commited premeditated murder, so, it is alright to do the same. I really don’t know, but, I would like to be able to work this out from my Christian philosophy and what I learned from the Lord. I welcome all the various takes on this and am open to others views. There were so many assassination atempts on Hitler’s life that it seemed he was supernaturally invincible and it can only be explained in that nothing happens outside of God’s will, ultimately. So, while it seems Satan had his day through Hitler, does not the Lord have eyes that He can see, and ears that He can hear, and, as the Jews ask, “Where was God during the holocaust?” Is that the bigger question? God answers both questions, in my mind. “In all their afflictions, I was afflicted.” “And whatever you do to the least of these, my brothers, you do to me.” And “that hell below, was moved to greet Hitler at his coming” brings some solace, but, it does not replace those who lost their lives. What if, God, willing to show His great power and glory, will raise up those dried bones, as in Ezekiel, and put flesh on them once more and breath the spirit of life back into them, and by doing so, put Hitler and Satan to shame and shut their mouths and torment them forever as they tormented others, would that be enough? It would for me. Although, I don’t want to even have to watch that. I pray the Lord dumps them in the lake of fire, and that I have no memory of them at all. And I’m reminded of another idea, in that the Jews would not have suffered what they did, “except the Lord had sold them” to their enemy. Do we know the mind of God? I certainly don’t. Neither do I know His purposes from beginning to end, but, I do trust Him, and if He caused Michael to retreat, there was a reason for it.
I’ve more thoughts on this, but, I just wanted to open up a discussion. I’d like to hear some others views about it.
I may have gotten mixed up and placed my comment under the wrong heading. I won’t know until I listen to both again. So, if you need to, you can put it under the proper heading.
Thanks.
I like Bonhoeffer’s guts and concern for truth.